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Camping KarmaHow to avoid forest faux pas |
Dear Helena,
Last year my husband and I went camping with some friends, and it was kind of rough. We brought good-quality sausages and romaine lettuce and good beer. Their contribution was to go to Costco and stock up on a bunch of junk food and Bud Light in cans. They stayed up really late, getting loudly drunk, and in the morning the entire campsite was trashed with empties filled with cigarette butts, which I proceeded to clean up. My husband felt like I was uptight when I stated unequivocally that I didn’t want to camp with them ever again. But I feel there’s a polite and impolite way to camp with others, and they crossed some lines. What do you think? —Forest Floored
Dear Forest Floored,
When you’re camping, you’re essentially sharing living space with others. So many of the issues that arise are the same as those that crop up in roommate situations, such as noise, food, and cleaning. However, the strategies for dealing with them are a little different.
Shop for groceries together. I once went camping with a friend where we agreed we’d “just buy a bunch of stuff on our own and share it.” He and his girlfriend gobbled up an artisanal loaf of bread I’d brought. When I mentioned it, he assured me that he had a loaf of premade, frozen garlic bread I could eat. I wasn’t too pleased. A good way to minimize potential conflict is to go grocery shopping together beforehand. There will inevitably have to be some compromises (for instance, maybe it’s important to you to have better beer than Tecate, so you agree to pay for your own stash separately), but at least you’ll get this hashed out before you’re stuck in the woods. (Note: Cans of beer are indeed better than bottles, as they’re lighter and the empties are crushable. And—good news for beer snobs—plenty of craft beers now come in cans.)
Keep the campsite clean. Common areas should be kept tidy. Don’t forget to bring trash bags. I like to bring a tablecloth for the picnic table to catch spills and keep ants from gathering; it can be folded up between meals. When you decamp, leave the site cleaner than when you found it. At all costs, do not leave bottles in the fire pit. According to Ranger D. Stephen of Portola Redwoods State Park in California, “They can heat up and explode.”
Secure food from animals. Obviously it would be poor manners to leave food out in the open where animals can get it. But raccoons, bears, and the occasional rodent you may encounter while camping can be very smart. According to Stephen, the wooden storage boxes often provided by campsites have been broken into and should not be depended upon. Nor should most cheap coolers. Some friends of mine once had a raccoon open an unlocked cooler and eat every single one of the items inside, including an entire bunch of grapes. Food is safe from most animals in bear containers, hung from trees, in locking coolers, or in the trunk of your car.
Play folk not rock. People often have very different ideas about music, especially when camping. Some love to have their tunes playing at all times, while others feel recorded music ruins the camping experience. You can ask your friends ahead of time if they mind if you bring an iPod, but most people will politely say they don’t mind even if they do. In my opinion, it’s better to avoid the issue altogether and leave the speakers behind. An acoustic guitar, passed around the campfire for late-night Neil Young sing-alongs, seems less controversial and more fitting somehow.
Provide a surprise. Tammie Dooley, a freelance travel writer in Oklahoma, says her special camping nightcap is Swiss Miss Dark Chocolate Sensation cocoa mix with butterscotch schnapps. My own specialty is bacon toast. You drench a slice of bread with leftover bacon fat and grill it. This might sound gross, but if you have a slight hangover from drinking too many beers around the campfire, it’s the perfect remedy. Also, you might want to think about leaving a small token for strangers, in the interests of camping karma. There’s nothing better than arriving at a campsite and finding that the last inhabitants have left you a stack of firewood.
It seems the OP didn't know her "friends" very well. If they are true friends, how can you NOT know they are a little slobbish and like cheap beer? The whole situation could have been made easier if the OP and her friends would have talked about plans beforehand. Pretty simple, huh?
Per Helena: "Food is safe from most animals in bear containers, hung from trees, in locking coolers, or in the trunk of your car."
If you're in bear country, NEVER store food in your vehicle, even the trunk. If they smell food in the trunk, they've been known to break into the cab of the car and rip thru the back seat to get into the trunk.
It's amazing the damage they can cause.
http://outhiking.com/bears_car1a.jpg
http://images.google.com/imgres?imgur...
http://www.nytimes.com/1997/11/30/us/...
Some people go camping to party, others to chill. Some want to commune with nature, others think of it just as a cheap hotel, and want to do other activities. There is nothing wrong with any of the reasons (except you should always clean up before you leave). You just need to go camping with people who want the same thing you do. It sounds like that even you and your husband did not even agree what camping means.
If you are camping in a campground, surrounded by other campers in close proximity, please do not "stay up really late, getting loudly drunk." You'll keep everyone up with you. It's fine if you want to stay up late, or get drunk, but please do not do it loudly.
Also, LauraB706 beat me to it, but never store food in your cain bear country. Hang it from a tree away from your tent.
I think it's a great idea to pass along goodies in the interest of Camping Karma- However, firewood should never be transported. It allows invasive wood boring beetles to feast on whole new forests. I don't know about the west coast, but this is a serious issue on the east coast.
According to DCNR Secretary Michael DiBerardinis “We are asking travelers not to give the Emerald Ash Borer a free ride in firewood they might be transporting. All wood should be purchased locally and burned entirely.” Here's the website:
http://www.dcnr.state.pa.us/news/reso...
Camping with friends can be a real treat. or the worst experience in your life.
I do have simular stories, and thats why I have a short list of people i choose to camp with. shopping together is key. Bringing too much food is not. Every list that you make for food with with the fellow campers should be cut in half. I have seen and have had so much food left over that goes to spoil "unless you are camping with heavy eaters" one thing I never lack on is the fluids, I normally have one cooler desingated just for fluids "if i am car camping" and the fluids are in bulk containers,
cups are issued with sharpie labled names with a few extra cups for misshaps. this cuts down on waste and bees. But just incase you are camping with some one you dont really know feed your self, and let them take care of them selves. you never know what you brought may just fit purfect with what they have. If not smores allways makes end of the night a bit better. Try a peanut butter cup on yous next time.
We camp twice a year at a large music festival, with a core group who come to every festival, along with a kind of rotating group of people who come now and then. We used to say just bring stuff to eat and we'll all share. Inevitably, a couple of us would bring practical items that required some advance preparation (frozen soup is great for keeping the cooler cold and then you can eat it as it thaws, salad fixings, sandwich ingredients etc.) while others would go to Costco and bring a ton of red licorice, and another would bring a ton of trail mix. I solved that one by assigning a shopping list to anyone who couldn't be relied on to know what to bring. And you know what? They really appreciate being given a list and showing up confident that they brought something that will contribute to the group meals.
There is such a range of camping experiences. Are you talking about a campsite with RVs on pads with electricty, water, and trash pick-up or are you hiking 12 miles into the outback with resources limited to what you carry in on your back (and carry back out again) - and every shade of shelter, sleeping accommodations, and cooking facilities in between. Helena is right about the shopping, moreover all the aspects of the experience should be discussed and agreed on before you pull out of your driveways. I remember camping once in high school and one of the girls came out of her tent in tears because there was no place to plug in her hair dryer.
ps: discussion of what restroom facilities, for purposes, is also important to verify and plan for.
Difference in philosophies. Firstly, while I think Forest Floored is a bit too high-end minded for camping, I agree that she shouldn't camp with the other folks in the future. It made the experience unenjoyable for her, which is what matters.
The cleaning up of the other peoples' mess (or the tone of the reportage of same) strikes me as pretty passive-aggressive.
Agreed, Forest Floored is too high-maintenance for camping. Go stay in a resort cabin next time and have your food catered in. I'm sure bugs bothered her too.
Helena, complaining that your friends ate your "special" artisanal (a word I'm beginning to hate due to its overuse by snobs) loaf of bread is just childish. If you didn't want to share your damn bread, then you should not have brought it, as that was the whole point of “just buy a bunch of stuff on our own and share it”, right?
I don't know where most of you go camping, but the places I frequent ban glass bottles of any and all kinds. Meaning plastic and aluminum only. If we want wine, we put it in a non-reactive container and bring it - but usually we suck it up and get some good canned beer (Fat Tire in a can is divine) and a couple of plastic gallon jugs of filtered water per day. If you're carrying all your gear on your back, the last thing you're worried about is beer. :-D
Regardless of how/where you camp, I implore you to use the <a href=:http://www.lnt.org/">Leave No Trace</a> guidelines: Plan Ahead and Prepare | Travel and Camp on Durable Surfaces | Dispose of Waste Properly | Leave What You Find |
Minimize Campfire Impacts | Respect Wildlife | Be Considerate of Other Visitors.
Would eliminate a lot of problems for sure...well, except for people who expect an extraordinary amount of snobbery in everything they do. ;-)
I must agree wholeheartedly with Akitist and blogkitten: when I read the poster's letter, I thought that she sounded too high-maintenance for camping. I also fail to see anything wrong with the behaviour of her friends, apart from the loudness. Most of the people I know - even the ones who are quite prim and proper - kick back, rough it up, and get drunk and binge out on junk food when they go camping. If I want to sip high-quality drinks and eat good food, I'll go stay at a nice hotel, not the woods.
Furthermore, why did she clean up her friends' mess? Give them a chance to do so when they wake up. I'd say that doing so and then getting irked about it was the biggest line that was crossed in this trip, to be honest.
I goto at least 6-8 music festivals every year and I have some basic rules.
#1 - Bring your own beer, don't mooch off of mine.
#2 - Bring your own headies, see above
#3 - Leave it as you found it!
It is ok to get messy at night, as long as you pick it up when you wake up.
Personally I hate alcohol mixed with camping, I want to hear crickets not lame commentary from those who can't afford a better place to stay. I go to state parks which typically ban alcohol and have nicer, woodsier lots.
@blogkitten---sharing involves both parties, the friends ate the entire loaf of bread brought by Helena thus there was no sharing
Considering some people's comments, I too would be considered a high-maintenance camper! Sometimes we have hot dogs and marshmallows with Dogfish Head, other times there's a steak or shrimp we've decided to marinate on the drive down to the camp site. During desert camping I made gnocchi. Prior to then, Gatorade was frozen in batches and added to the cooler so we'd have frozen slushes, in addition to the beer and wine (boxed).
If someone started with folk music, I would be pissed. I hated that at camp when I was a kid and have no love for it now.
BTW: any type of travel with others can make or break friendships, it's not limited to camping.
I'm with Sally!
I don't consider myself high-maintenance or prissy in any way, but getting drunk and eating crap I normally wouldn't touch would really wreck a camping experience for me!
I would go camping with friends who are looking for an inexpensive way to spend a couple weeks at the beach with their kids, and would adhere to diet and probably more routine than we have at home. A glass of decent wine that matches dinner, an afternoon g&t or bourbon nightcap--yum!
For me, camping is about getting outdoors, hearing night sounds, getting away from street lights, trying our hand at fishing, simple wonderment at the fire, digging up worms, checking out the bugs/flowers/animals/nests/ sticker bushes...
I don't think this kind of disagreement has to end friendships, as long as it's handled with grace and a level head (and honestly, if you know them enough to sleep next to them, don't you know their basic approach?)
Nice post. But I'm from Oklahoma, not Ohio. They do both start with an "O". After a 20 minute interview (that would be 20 minutes of MY time), it'd be nice to know you knew where I was from. -- Tammie Dooley, freelance travel writer from OKLAHOMA.
@Sally599 - Not true. They brought "a loaf of premade, frozen garlic bread" to share - sharing is sharing, regardless of the "quality" of the offering. It wasn't their fault Helena turned her nose up at it and didn't eat it, it's also her fault for not being more specific about what "quality" level she was expecting from these friends. In addition, she didn't mention whether or not these friends ate that garlic bread in addition to the other bread.
Expectations need to be addressed up front, not after the fact when one sits there surprised that other people don't think the same way as they do.
@Tammie Dooley - that's the level of detail we've come to expect here. ^_^
Moral of the story here: camp with people you KNOW will have the same expectations you have and PLAN AHEAD WITH YOUR FOOD.
We made the change, Tammie.
Wow- there's a lot of good advice here. Here's my $ .02-
If you know you're going to be camping with people who shop at convenience marts, here's a thought- maybe you could ratchet down a little bit and be sure you're not trying to subliminally outdo your fellow campers. One time I went camping with a bunch of girlfriends, and we went to the store beforehandmand I got a big bag of raw green beans (one of my favorite hot weather raw snacks)- they couldn't believe anybody would eat raw green beans, but damn if they weren't gone by the middle of the next day, and I had barely had any. I should have bought more.
You might want to take extra of something you suspect everybody wil end up craving, or else hide it. I don't think that's too horrible if you know you're with a bunch of moochy types. You bought it, after all, but try not to go overboard hiding your stash.
Make the slobs pick up after themselves. If they flat out refuse, you can do it for them if you want but you're a fool to ever go with them again, or let them go with you. Picking up after them smacks of passive-aggressive disapproval, however. People like that rarely care, or even notice.
what a bunch of uptight bores. My advice is to develop your social skills so that you can manage these situations easily, rather than making a mountain out of a mole hill. If you don't like your "friends" enough to share a loaf of bread with them, maybe you shouldn't go camping with them. Next time just dole it out yourself to make sure you get some.
The worst thing in the world is camping and wanting to commune with nature and have a bit of quiet, and the knuckleheads across the campground are blasting Metallica, whooping it up into the wee hours, guzzling beer and being obnoxious. Camping is not about "party dudes!" it's about quiet time with family and Nature. This is not just my own hang-up, but also that of the National Park Service, which has all sorts of rules regarding this type of misbehavior. If you just want to party, why ruin the still quiet of Nature to do so? Just stay home and barbecue.
I couldn't agree more, EarlyBird. I think vorpal and others who think camping is all about the noise and drunkenness are the ones who should find a cheap hotel, not those of us who want to enjoy a peaceful evening in nature, maybe with a good beer.
a.leistra: I'd like to point out that *I* never said myself that camping is all about being drunk and noisy; I simply said that most of the people I know do. I actually don't drink myself and I'm fairly quiet; however, I expect when I go camping with people that others will partake to excess and let loose and be a bit rowdy.
It sounds like it would be a good idea to plan out a menu in advance? Especially if you're just staying for a night or two (of course planning every meal for a week might be too much of an undertaking for what should be a relaxing time).
Stick with simple things: sandwiches, things roasted over the fire, etc. You could just tell your friend, "I can bring the bread if you bring some sliced meats and cheese" or whatever.
Takat
Writing away about my latest 3 week adventure through China at http://katacomb.blogspot.com
You should never go camping with people you can't discuss food and plans with in advance -- especially if food is a big deal for you. (In which case, you may want to request responsibility for the shopping and cooking.)
It's possible to cook some great meals while camping, but let's be honest, for most people it's about food cooked on a stick, not restaurant-quality entrées. That's part of the fun!
Bud Light in cans, up late and noisy, cigarette buts making a smelly mess? I would so gladly wear the label "uptight" to avoid ever camping with those people again.
I suppose its possible that the offending parties are good old friends from said husband's past, that he may live a slightly different life now but still enjoy time with them on their terms on occasion, and if that's important to him it's probably worth knowing what you are getting into and sucking it up one weekend a year.
other than that, i'm very much on the side of not camping with these folks again.
and yeah, c'mon folks, this is chowhound - if you can't throw some good quality sausages on a grill when you are camping and toss a romaine salad, find another website to post on. dinner on my last camping trip (were talking car-camping here, coolers, charcoal, etc) involved grilled salmon filets with herbs and grilled zucchini, and a chilled french rose wine. it wasn't any more difficult than hot dogs and bud light, just tastier.
One more thing- I will get mad if you play high-volume death metal at the campsite, but i may just murder you without hesitation if you play loud country western or GOD FORBID folk music.
That's my taste, yours is very likely far different.
Best bet? No music. Lots of people go camping to escape the noise from town. Don't bring the noise with you. Do you want to smell my stale cologne all weekend? Didn't think so, its the same thing.
I very much agree with the idea of no amplified or recorded music at all - I wish this was a universal campground rule. I'd personally like to see it applied especially to modern pop-country - It's crazy to have this supposed "country" philosophy and then need to blast amplified music out in nature. But, yes, I'd like to see all recorded music out of campgrounds entirely. Don't bring your Ipod.
I think what Helena means by "folk" is music you make yourself, singing or playing quiet acoustic instruments. Personally, I think this depends on the campground - if you have close neighbors, your campfire singalong is probably intrusive, but if it's a pretty sparsely distributed campground, a little quiet singing before 10 pm doesnt seem too offensive. This is, of course, assuming you are not a terrible singer.
A librarian friend of mine just posted this to her facebook:
http://www.amazon.com/Apocalypse-Chow...
Even though it's supposedly about eating well through disasters, it sounds to me like good camping food.
Cases of beer and sausage... That sounds fine to me.
sorry, but camping is not meant to come with a thousand rules.
as for noise, c'mon....you don't go to campsites where people are practically on top of each other and expect silence and nothing but the birds chirping. Head into the deep woods if you want that. When I go communally camping, I bring earplugs. Partly because of those early bird campers...who by this example are also out obsessively campsite cleaning.
Forest Floored seriously, seriously needs to unclench. If non-gourmet food and beverage is your idea of a rough camping experience you've lead a very sheltered life indeed .
Actually, if I had to choose a bad camping experience, i'd probably choose one where someone looked down their nose at my food choices and tut-tutted over an empty on the site. Forest Floored would be one of the last people i'd ever want to camp with.
Or we could all just agree to act like adults and be respectful. That is maybe one rule, don't act so oppressed.
How about take a chill pill?
If you don't know the people too well, plan on going camping for just one or two nights. That way if the music is horrible and they are jerks and won't turn it down, you can count the hours till your out.
And while it would be best to coordinate on the food in advance, however if that's not possible be sure not to spend a wad on food and keep some good stuff in reserve. So don't buy kobe beef burgers-- and if you do and they are bringing frozen bubba burgers you aren't getting the short end of the stick.
As far as the trash, wait till the end of the last day to pick up and just tell 'em your philosophy is to leave a campsite better than you left it-- and hand them a garbage bag. If they don't clean up then clean up... and say goodbye forever to the jerks!