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Table Manners
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Ordering Off the Kids’ MenuCan grown-ups get little burgers? |
Dear Helena,
I went to a Mexican restaurant where the burritos are enormous. I knew if I ordered the regular size I’d end up taking two-thirds of it home, so I decided to order a burrito off the kids’ menu. My friend was embarrassed and refused to let me do it. But I have a small appetite and I don’t see why I should pay full price for a meal I’m not going to finish. Is it OK to order off the kids’ menu? If not, what’s the best way to get a small portion? —Birdlike Appetite
Dear Birdlike Appetite,
Lumberjacks may welcome giant portions, but many of us don’t. If you’re on a diet, you don’t relish the temptation to overeat. If you’re ecoconscious, you know that food consumes energy and resources in its production, so you’re reluctant to waste it. It’s not always convenient to take a doggy bag. And now that we’re in the grip of a recession, most of us would like to spend less on dining out.
Unless the menu says otherwise, you can order from the kids’ menu. The restaurants I called all said they would allow it. Chet Wryly, kitchen manager at Chenery Park in San Francisco, says: “We wouldn’t like everyone to do it, but if someone wanted to have a hamburger as an appetizer—the kids’ hamburger is really small—I don’t see why not.” Kevin Davis, chef and co-owner of Steelhead Diner in Seattle, says he’s happy to whip up a grilled cheese for the odd vendor from neighboring Pike Place Market. But, he says, “I wouldn’t want to let that get out much. ... If everyone ate off the kids’ menu, the restaurant wouldn’t make a profit.”
In other words, most restaurants will allow you to order a Lilliputian burger or a bowl of Cap’n Crunch, begrudgingly. The profit margin on the kids’ menu is usually tiny.
Of course, unless the menu states a minimum charge per diner, you’re not obliged to spend big in a restaurant (especially if other diners at your table are ordering plenty). As I’ve said before, it’s fine for two diners to split a salad and drink water. Smart restaurants want to make you happy so they can get your repeat business.
But by ordering off the kids’ menu you’re doing yourself a disservice. Most kids’ menus consist of bland fare like mac ’n’ cheese and chicken fingers. They may offer kid-size portions of one or two adult dishes, but usually the food is dumbed-down for childish palates. A kiddy burrito will likely come without salsa, guacamole, and all the rest—in other words, without all the stuff that makes a burrito good.
If you want a little person’s portion, you don’t have to infantilize yourself. Restaurants that offer small plates or tapas have been trendy for a few years now. Pick one of those, or look for a place that offers half sizes. The Steelhead Diner, for instance, offers several entrées in two sizes. “Sixty percent of the time people go for the half portion,” Davis says.
If half portions aren’t on offer, don’t be afraid to ask for one. The worst that can happen is the server will say no. Or if your companion is a nibbler too, you can split a dish with him or her. You can also order an appetizer for an entrée, or make a dinner out of sides. That’s what Osha Groetz of Candle Café in New York advocates: “We have 20 different sides. You can order one or two or three sides. … That’s cost-effective and healthier than the kids’ choices.”
If you choose one of these options, you’ll get a dainty dinner, and the server won’t humiliate you by asking if you want crayons with it.
Table Manners appears every Wednesday. Have a Table Manners question? Email Helena.
I'm not sure I fully agree. The question was whether it was OK to order off the kids menu, and I think it was meant "OK" from an etiquette, or ethical point of view, not just whether you can get away with it. In that sense, yes some restaurants might allow it, in order to keep customers happy, but to me it is taking advantage of a very low profit area meant to keep younger children happy so their parents can eat out. If too many people start taking advantage, then restaurants may end up adding a rule re age to the menu (as I have seen in a lot of places).
Also, the questioner seemed to imply having to take leftovers home was a problem, but if appetizers or sharing aren't an option, I think the appropriate thing to do is ask the restaurant to pack up what you don't finish.
There's another element of etiquette here as well; the question referred to the diner's friend feeling embarrassed, hence the question "was what I did OK?" In many ways, I think the most important principle of etiquette with this is to be respectful of your fellow diners and try not to do things that will make them squirm, within reason.
Another option for dinner, is to ask for lunch sized portions -- some restaurants will accommodate as well. Likewise, one or two appetizers may work as well, just ask the server to bring it out with your dining companions' entrees.
~H.C.
http://la-oc-foodie.blogspot.com
I thought adults were smart enough to figure out that if you want to eat smaller portions and/or lighter, then order a salad or an app or two, or make a special request. Guess I was wrong. And yes, it is odd for an adult to order off the children's menu.
Why are people so worried about if what they order will make the restaurant enough profit? If you go to the mall and buy a shirt on clearance, do you go and buy something full priced to make up for it? It’s up to the management of the restaurant to set the pricing, and if too many people are buying the smaller portions, a good businessperson would see the opportunity there, and expand their selection of small dishes and increase the margins on them. That way its a win-win situation, the customer's bill is lower in total dollars, so they can afford to come out more often, and the restaurant can just increase the profit margin on those small dishes to make up the difference. If you want something when you go out, just order and leave it up to them to tell you that you can't have it.
I have to disagree based on experience. I asked for a kids meal at a Burger King in Windsor Heights (Iowa) on the 4th of July last year because it had fewer French Fries (meaning fewer calories and less fat) than their smallest combo meal. However, I got a toy car with it. Needless to say, I was pretty upset with the serving staff.
Helena, I agree with you. Sometimes, just a tiny potion is just what I want. Not all places have apps or small plates or light salads, so you have to go with what works. Yes, it may be a bit silly or embarressing, but then my advice would be get over it. Also, I would dig getting a toy car with my meal. But then again, I actually don't have any compunctions about actually enjoying my meal whatever it may happen to be. If I bring a copy of the newspaper with me to read as I eat, great. If it comes with a toy car, damn straight I'm gonna play with it.
Seriously people, lighten up and just eat for goodness sake. ;)
Braniff, how can you be upset with the serving staff? You ordered a kid's meal. Kid's meals come with a toy. Surprise! You got a toy.
Needless to say, you need to relax that ego.
I kind of like getting the toy when I order a kid's meal. They make great desk flair.
I won't usually order off the kid's menu at a sit down restaurant, but if I'm getting fast food, or something ordered a counter, I do it all the time. Same thing with ice cream. The kid's cup is more than enough for me.
Braniff, there are adults who would've raised hell if there hadn't been a toy in that bag.
I don't do it myself, but my 15 year old daughter orders off of the kids menu at quite a few of the ethnic restaurants we frequent - smaller portions of the same good food. She has not been challenged yet.
I asked at an Outback Steakhouse once if I could order Mac & cheese from the kids' menu ( not vegetarian, just financially embarrassed and young son wanted to go there for his birthday, and besides, I LOVE mac & cheese). Waitress said sure, no problem- but I'm not sure I'd have the stones to ask that everywhere.
If I felt like I was being tacky by asking, I wouldn't.
Braniff, why were you upset? Did they make faces at you? Or are the other posters right that toys offend you? Can I have yours?
I agree with other posters that it's not the diners' problem if the restaurant doesn't make a profit. Bigger profits do not necessarily translate into better wages, better quality ingredients, or anything else that would improve my experience.
I disagree, however, with the statement that the profit margin on kids' menus are small. $5 for mac and cheese and steamed broccoli isn't so cheap when you consider that I can get a microwave single-serving of Kraft m&c at the grocery store for under $1, and produce is pretty cheap too. Oh--I forgot the plastic cup with lid. Really, do you expect us to believe that costs over $3, or that the restaurant is paying retail prices?
I think the better reason not to order off the kids' menu is the one you bury later in your story--the food's usually crappy and tasteless. We don't order from it because I want my son to be familiar with and enjoy a wide range of tastes and not learn to love deep-fried fat blobs. If I could find a place like the one jeanmarieok's 15-yr-old daughter orders from the kids' menu, we (6-yr-old and me) would both do it in a heartbeat.
I think its pretty lame for an adult to order a kids meal no matter what their excuse(calorie's, portion size, etc).
Swsidejim, why do you consider it "lame"? I personally might not want to do it, but why should it matter what someone else orders, if they have a reason, or if they just want the toy, it's their choice and it shouldn't matter to anyone else.
I agree with Swsidejim- it's terribly lame and I'd be mortified if someone I was with tried pulling this off. It's pretty tacky to boot.
just my opinion, I wouldnt disown anyone over it, but I would tease the sh*t out of them if they did it in front of me. Kids meals are for kids, not adults.
what use does an adult have for a toy, other than to give it to their child? If my daughter really liked a toy one of the faast food places was giving away, I might buy the meal get the toy, and throw the crap food out.
In Europe, most restaurants would not allow you to choose from the kids menu. Most of restaurants would be happy to serve you two appetizers though (or one if you cant even manage that).
Usually I like to eat a full 3-course meal but cannot manage that with normal portions, so very often I eat two appetizers and one dessert. If I see something on the main course menu, I just ask for it sized down to an appetizer. Sometimes they charge you full price, sometimes they take the cost down, but I have never experienced a weird look or question or any wrong reaction and they have allways obliged.
While I think it's a bit strange to order from the kiddie menu it is a good alternative if you aren't hungry enough for a full-sized meal. I was bugged by the attitude of the dining companion who "refused" to let the OP do it. How is that their business? It's really overreaching to try to control the actions of another adult.
I would never order off the kids' menu in a sit down restaurant. Lots of times it will say "For children 12 and under" or something like that anyway, and it's true that the choices are usually boring compared to what the restaurant's normal fare would be (grilled cheese, spaghetti, etc.) But at a fast food place, I don't think it's as big of a deal, since it's just a smaller burger and a smaller portion of fries, but it's the same stuff, essentially. It doesn't seem as "wrong" to me at a fast food place.
If the toy's a good one, heck yeah I'll order a kiddie meal just to get the toy at a fast food place,
Order what you want. If the restaurant has no restriction, then by all means you should feel free to order a smaller portion, no matter how it is labeled (child, lite, lunch, half order, petite - I have seen them all.) And it's really nobody else's business what you choose to order. If they are embarrassed, that's their problem, I see no reason to make it yours.
The restaurant is there to serve you, the customer.
By all means, if you want to order off the small folk menu, and they have no set rules against it, Just Do It! We are talkin' chain restaurants here, right?
And here's what I think about the toy. I'm at age 50 and I will at times seek out the toy. Sometimes some crayons to mark up place mats, draw mustaches on faces, play hangman, whatever. The biggie is a visit to Wienerschnitzel! There I can purchase a wiener toy that I can jamb onto my vehicle antenna and proudly show my wiener off as I drive around town.
In closing, order from the child's menu if u wish and by all means, suck it up and get the toy too! Save 'em too. They may be worth something on Ebay in a few hundred years. Anyone want some mini Beanie Babies from McDonalds? That's BnF's take on this matter.
-BnF
I frequently ordered the Kids Meal at a Chinese style place in a food court at uni/college. For $5 Australian (I think its about $6.50 now!) you could get a large spring roll, honey chicken, fried rice, mixed vegetables and a 500ml juice. It was one of the best value choices that I could find as a student for a purchased lunch...it was always a popular choice and in fact I can't recall ever seeing a child eating it!
I think a restaurant should not balk at it, and I agree that if it became a profitability problem, they should adjust the menu accordingly. On the flip side, many times I do not want to order the kids meals for my kids, and instead ask a restaurant to make a half portion of something on the regular menu for my kids. They usually charge half to 2/3rds. I don't see why you couldn't make the same request as an adult, if you ask kindly. The chains might have a problem - for them you order off the kids menu or stick with appetizers/salads. Fine restaurants that make one dish at a time shouldn't mind.
I agree with some of the other posters, When I see the items on most restaurants kids menus(cheese pizza, chicken fingers, hot dog, hamburger, kraft mac-n-cheese, etc) I dont even want my kids ordering off it.
As a side note, some fast food places will let you just buy the toy. You don't have to get the crappy food and throw it away if you don't want it.....no waste!
I don't mind buying kid's meals at fast food places, though I would feel a little bad about doing so at a restaurant. In fact, if I'm on the road, and food options are limited, I'll go to Arby's and get a kids meal. they have a mini-turkey sandwhich (I think turkey breast, swiss, bread) along with a side of applesauce (or maybe some other fruit-like option and juice or milk. Far from the most appetizing meal ever, but not bad in comparison to other oil-laden fried options or salads that are difficult to eat in the car (plus still have loads of cheese and other fatty type things in them). If I still have 5 hrs of driving ahead of me, I don't want something grease-laden sitting in my stomach. Plus, I don't like getting overly full since that is just a horrible feeling to have while stuck in a car, driving. Also, the toy is usually not linked to any movie / commercial character and is instead along the educational vein of things, which I appreciate. Last time I got one of those meals, the 'toy' was a mini-board book about the statue of liberty, which I gave to my friend's 2 year old daughter.
This is a great question -- I often have the same issue.
I wouldn't give a rat's arse if my dining companions looked askance at what I ordered -- as if I care that much about other people's opinion!!
Having said that, I don't dine at chain restaurants and then order off the kids menu.
I do go to places that have tapas and small plates.
The main place I am thinking of is a take-away panini window that has kids-sized panini. The normal ones are too large and I hate paying for food I won't eat all of or won't keep for later.
So, swsidejim and invinotheresverde -- you both think it's "pretty lame" and inexcusable and "pretty tacky" and you'd be mortified if a dining companion selected from the kids menu?
Gee, judgmental MUCH?
So glad I will never dine with either of you!
How utterly impolite of you to make a person feel uncomfortable because of their choice.
Not that *I'd* care, but did you ever think of other people's feelings beyond your own?
<end rant>
It just boggles my mind that anyone would get uppity about such a silly thing. You want to order off the kids menu? Go for it. I wish my appetite was small enough to be so easily satisfied.
Max, you can try to swing this as swsidejim and I having the problem in this situation, but there's no way I'm feeling guilty. Adults ordering off the KID'S MENU is tacky beyond belief. Besides the food usually consisting of crap items that I wouldn't feed my kid, there's usually an age limit. I'm not under twelve.
I have tried to order off of the kids menu periodically because I had gastric bypass surgery and just can't eat much at one time. I have been turned down everywhere, even when I produce my card, except at Cracker Barrel. You can order whatever you want, any size on their menu. Most of the restaurans in my area offer ridiculous portions. From a profit margin standpoint, I would be happy to get half the food at only a third off the price. Someone mentioned ordering a salad, here they can be some of the biggest dishes.
It is important to keep your server in mind if you can order off a kids menu or a lunch menu. If the service is good, tip like you ordered off of the regular dinner menu. They work just as hard whatever size dish you order.
Depending on the company, it doesn't hurt to ask. I wouldn't try this when I was with a client or on a date... or even at a nicer restaurant. That's just me, though. My only problem with it is that people hate and often wont tolerate being told no. Many restaurant patrons think that just because the restaurant makes it for children or has a certain ingredient, that they can and should do whatever is being asked of them. I've listened to debates between diners and restaurant management over policies and it gets to the point of just being ridiculous. If you want it, ask. If they say no or advise you that it's not a good idea, just be gracious and forget about it.
I think the best time to order from a kid's menu is take-out from an ethnic restaurant.
Or from a fast food counter. Or any kind of counter
I would never give waitstaff an order from a child's menu. That's what appetizers are for.
If you are trying to save money, the best trick is to order take out from lunch specials and have them for dinner.
Chinese food microwaves beautifully and so does a lot of other ethnic stuff.
Gee, lighten up Max, pretty thin skinned huh?
I said it was lame, never said I would be "mortified", "it was tacky", or "inexcusable". I said I would tease the sh*t out of a friend if they pulled a cheap stunt like ordering off the kids menu.
Luckily my friends & I have thick skin, and we can joke with each other without someone running to the restroom and crying like a girl. You wouldn't survive in my group of friends.
"Chet Wryly"
Best name. Ever.
Fast-food companies are one thing, but most "real" (meaning sit-down) restaurants do have age-group limits for their junior selections, (12 and under, 10 and under) so it's a moot point.
As a vegetarian (for 20 years), the age limit kind of frosts my flakes, because adult or not, I should be able to get mac and cheese if there are no other meat-free options or none that appeal to me that day. (and hey, the free toy gift may make a nice desk ornament. I have two Pez dispensers as desk ornaments, and I sometimes USE them :-D)
That said, usually, I wouldn't find any of the kiddie offerings in most restos appealing, because it's not just mini portions of the regular fare, but bland, greasy, flavorless stuff that cannot be appreciated by anyone who isn't barely out of infancy. I say that the restos should ditch the children's menu altogether and just have mini-portions of their standard items available to anyone who asks for them , and little Brandon or little Crystal will just have to suck it up and learn that there are other things to eat in the world besides deep-fried grease and starch with a saturated-fat topping.
But this column is really about deportment, and I think the one who committed the breach of deportment was the OP's dining partner for making such a fuss instead of adopting a live-and-let-live attitude.
Also, it depends on the dining partner. A good friend, or family, or solo dining is one thing, but I would NOT order a kid's dish when with a gentleman who has the potential to be my Heart's True Hero, for then I'd look like a zero in front of my hero.
Wendy's Jr. Bacon Cheeseburgers FTW! Most restaurants I go to either do not offer a kid's menu or have it clearly state that you cannot order this items unless you under a certain age, but honestly, it would be nice if I didn't have to take half or two-thirds of my dinner home because the servings are so large. I've also found that if I ask for less, especially at chain restaurants, they will tell me they can give me less, but only at the same cost, which really irks me. They will tell me things like, "Well, side dishes are complimentary, so even if you only got the [insert entree here], you still have to pay full price."
I've done it. I'm diabetic, and have to eat fairly frequently. If I always ordered a regular meal, I'd balloon again. At Burger King, I can't even finish a Whopper anymore; a Whopper Jr. with a side salad is more than enough. (And now they offer a pretty good balsamic vinegar dressing, so that salad becomes even more tasty). But there are times when even a Whopper Jr. is too much, so I'll order the kids' burger and the salad. And the Jr. Bacon Cheeseburger at Wendy's isn't bat either.
And I don't feel the least bit embarrassed asking for half-orders of things like pasta; I realize they're not going to cut a steak in half for me. I wish more spots would offer a small steak besides a filet, which I think doesn't have much flavour. But everyone seems to offer 12-oz or 16-oz or bigger steaks. I can't finish one of those, and some times a doggy bag just isn't an option (like when you're on the road and your hotel doesn't have a fridge).
Due to stomach surgery, I cannot eat a full order or sometimes a half order, so I will often order from the "under 12" menu at a chain restaurant. The help look at me strangely but I politely explain my reason and if they don't like it, I take my business and my money elsewhere. At a nice sit down restaurant, I most often order an app and give what I cannot finish to my husband. We have learned to "combine" our orders; we order two smaller dinners from the lite menu and I give him my salad or soup, so he has a complete dinner and I have a smaller entree.
I always order from the kids menu at the deli. A cup of matzah ball soup. a small turkey sandwich, french fries, and a diet coke is way more than enough. I've never heard a word of complaint from any of the waitresses. In fact, when I was a kid, my brother and I would share a kiddie meal (they gave soo much food) and the waitress would bring out the meal on two plates with half a sandwich and some fries on each.
I always order from the kids menu at the deli. A cup of matzah ball soup. a small turkey sandwich, french fries, and a diet coke is way more than enough. I've never heard a word of complaint from any of the waitresses. In fact, when I was a kid, my brother and I would share a kiddie meal (they gave soo much food) and the waitress would bring out the meal on two plates with half a sandwich and some fries on each.
I wish that restaurants would just start serving smaller portions, a couple of weeks ago I went to dinner, and my friend ordered some sort of chicken dish with pasta, her plate contained THREE chicken breasts, and probably equivalent to an entire box of spaghetti. Both of us wouldn't have been able to finish all that food.
As is often mentioned on the boards here, people can find themselves in restaurants that were not their first choice for food they prefer. In that situation, if you see something on the kids menu that appeals to you, by all means order it! This may be your only option if you're watching your portion size, needing that toy, or just craving chicken nuggets that day. Its a restauraunt -- have what you want!
What IS tacky is asking for a reduced price for a reduced portion. If you're really strapped for dining cash, just have an appetizer instead of a meal. And if you're worried about your dining companion's opinion of all this, then IMHO its their problem, not yours.
I've been seeing some "senior" menu items on some chain restaurant menus lately. These are, I assume, smaller portions for those whose appetites aren't quite up to trencherman's portions. I am occasionally tempted to order from that column, just to see if the server has the temerity to tell me I don't LOOK over 55 (ok, fishing for compliments here....)
I wouldn't mind doing it at a fast food drive thru window.... that's about it
I wouldn't feel comfortable about doing it at a sit down restaurant. Those prices are obviously loss leaders and it seems like it is taking advantage to do so.
If you want a small portion, it might be less embarrassing (if that's something you care about) to ask for a small portion. Failing that, certainly order from the kids' menu if that calls to you. And if you get grief about that, ask pointedly what they suggest, since you are not hungry enough to eat one of the gargantuan American portions of food and have noplace to store leftovers (going out after dinner, travelling in a different city, etc.).
I agree that fast food kid's meal toys make great desk decorations. I rarely eat fast food but when McDonald's had the "Clone Wars" Happy Meal toys I got one because one of them had a hat on that looked exactly like the ones the guys in DEVO wore. I heard DEVO was about to sue so I figured it would be a collector's item. I wasn't the only one; the counterperson said "man, everyone's been asking for this one."
That being said, I also agree that for the most part kid's menus are chicken fingers/hamburger/french fries/pasta with butter/grilled cheese. I frequently order appetizers as entrees at chain restaurants, such as the rib tips and fries at Famous Dave's and the combo platters at Chili's and Uno Grille. With the combos, though, sometimes THAT'S too much food as well.
You can have little hamburgers at nice restaurants. They're called sliders and they cost about $30/lb
I used to work at a fairly high-end restaurant and we would allow people to order from the kids menu, however, we would throw in a little more food or maybe a salad and bump the price up by a couple bucks. We made sure the customer was aware of this and rarely got any flak for it. The purpose of this was to weed out the cheapskates. Once we bumped the price up it was at least on par with some of the sandwiches on the menu. I once allowed a woman to order the kids mac n cheese (normal kids size and price) because she said she had just had gastric bypass and that was all she would be able to eat anyway. She ran my butt in circles getting her more bread, butter, and water (free of course). She ate THREE baskets of bread and probably drank a half a gallon of water. Her tab? $3.95. My tip? .05 Never again did I make that mistake.
And I too, would crawl under the table if I was with someone who tried to order off the kids menu. You're a grown up. It's time to eat grown up food.
Stillwater Girl, is there really such a thing as "grown up food?" I mean, can you label food with an age group? Everyone has different tastes. You can be 10 and in fifth grade and go for pasta salad with sun-dried tomatoes and artichoke hearts, or you can be 35 and the president of a company and love mac and cheese. It depends on the person.
I know the post is old but I had to comment. People who have had gastric bypass surgery are taught to order off the childs menu. Their stomachs cannot hold more then the size of an egg, especially soon after the surgery. In fact patients are given cards to explain the situation to the restaurant staff.
I don't think ordering from a kid's meal is the worst thing you can do, but I usually don't fancy the children's meal selections since it's a bit limited and boring in most restaurants. When I'm not too hungry I'll order from the $1.00 menu if I'm at a fast food joint. In a nicer place I go for an appetizer and/or one of two things on the side order selection. I also have a problem taking home leftovers and actually eating them if I can't finish a good meal rather than waste it.