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Demeyere Industry 5 Opinions?

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1 day ago
randallhank in Cookware

Demeyere Industry 5 Opinions?

"Sounds to this girl like you just don't like Zwilling."

That can't be it because he still loves Staub (at his fingertips). It's only limited to Demeyere + Zwilling. He liked them better apart -- like in a soap opera, or a romance novel? Maybe they weren't meant to be together? Or maybe he is just still rationalizing his D5 purchase?

1 day ago
randallhank in Cookware

Demeyere Industry 5 Opinions?

I have had nothing but wonderful customer service from the folks at Zwilling. The customer service department in the U.S. serves all of the their manufacturers.

1 day ago
randallhank in Cookware

Demeyere Industry 5 Opinions?

There is no "undercutting" going on. This is no different than All-Clad selling the brushed version of D5 through Williams Sonoma, and then selling a polished version through another vendor (or vice versa). We have no evidence that Sur la Table was even concerned that the construction of the Sensation line was the same as Industry 5. They probably correctly assumed that most their customers weren't even aware of the similarity, or even of the existence of the other line. The Industry 5 styling was distinct enough (certainly more so than the different versions of D5), and the sets and pieces available were different. That 4 quart Industry sauté I mentioned in another link? Not available in Sensation. Ditto for the 3 quart Essential Pan.

We are speculating on contracts that the Zwilling group and its merchants agreed to that we know absolutely nothing about. Absolutely nothing. We have no knowledge of the details and parameters of such agreements, so we shouldn't assume anything went wrong, nor should we be making any assumptions whatsoever about how it reflects generally on the company.

I have heard of no lawsuits or disagreements between the Zwilling Group and Sur la Table. There's a little principal called "lack of evidence to the contrary," in play here, so we should all assume everything was within the bounds of their agreement. Further, Sur la Table sells tons of stuff from the various Zwilling group manufacturers, so the evidence we DO have indicates they are still very much in good graces with one another.

Ray is just indulging in total fantasy here.

Demeyere Industry 5 Opinions?

Philosophical:

a) Being "leery" of something with absolutely no imperial evidence or without any logical reason. (Oh, wait, that reads more like the entry for "superstitious")

b) preferring one name over another because, oddly, Demeyere sounds just a bit more German than Zwilling. (Plus, Demeyere has videos with European men in white lab coats, thus their cookware must be "optimized" for induction). But the Staub warranty (also part of Zwilling) is written in gold?

1 day ago
randallhank in Cookware

Demeyere Industry 5 Opinions?

"My decision was also influenced by weight (too heavy) and the nearly vertical sidewalls"

So, weight, size, and shape are excellent examples of "personal preference." Very interesting. Tell me more...

"I would not purchase a D5 pan for any reason, as the middle steel layer is not magnetic."

Yes, the middle layer is there for stability only, to prevent warping. To be fair, pans that remain flat no doubt work better on induction cooktops. However, All-Clad's response to this problem was to add a layer of cheap steel rather than more conductive material. Heaven forbid they just make the conductive layer thicker and render their entire product line irrelevant.

Demeyere pans are well known for resisting warpage. In fact, Demeyere's "Triplinduc" does not actually optimize the pan's performance on induction by improving magnetic response, but rather it optimizes the pan's response to the heat, In other words, this technology is also there to aid in pan stability on the cooktop. Some people don't understand this and try to make into some magical hocus pocus thing that Demeyere has researched over decades or something. What they were researching was a combination of steel alloys that respond to HEAT a certain way, NOT induction itself.

I think someone needs to learn the difference between "philosophical" and "theoretical."

I'm not going to tell my ostrich story again, but when people say something is good or bad, I always say "compared to what?" User experience is over-rated, and only really valuable in the aggregate, especially if you suspect the reviewer is kind of a moron:

http://www.forbes.com/sites/geoffreym...

1 day ago
randallhank in Cookware

Miracle Maid Aluminum Skillet

By my calculations, the bottom of this roaster sans lid can hold nearly 14 quarts. That's one big turkey!

1 day ago
randallhank in Cookware

Miracle Maid Aluminum Skillet

I like it! Enjoy CJ!

1 day ago
randallhank in Cookware

Demeyere Industry 5 Opinions?

Speaking of which, what does the "D" in "d5" stand for? Demeyere?

1 day ago
randallhank in Cookware

Miracle Maid Aluminum Skillet

Advertised as "Gem Coat':

http://www.rubylane.com/item/167844-1...

There are a few pieces on ebay as well. You gotta love this roaster:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Miracle-Maid-...

Jul 29, 2015
randallhank in Cookware

Demeyere Industry 5 Opinions?

Great to hear. Most of my Demeyere is Atlantis, but I have been using an Industry skillet for a while now, and I just picked up 2 more pieces of Sensation.

I do not own any D5, but I have owned several pieces of both All-Clad Stainless and Copper Core. The All-Clad was really solid cookware. I didn't even mind the handles. It just never thought it cooked that well to justify the high price, or to move away from the straight gauge aluminum I was happily using (on gas back then). The D5 didn't improve its clad construction in a way that mattered to me. My gripe with clad in general is that the ratio of steel to conductive material is too small, the steel grabs up too much heat and the aluminum is too thin to help displace it when turning down the burner (gas, induction) or removing from the heat source (coil). All-Clad doesn't try to claim that a thinner conductive core is better. They know otherwise. Their decision to go with <2mm of conductive material is based on two factors: weight and expense (and not necessarily in that order). It may be hard to grasp that adding 25% more aluminum would make much of a difference in cooking results, but we are dealing with fairly thin layers here, and in my experience with stainless clad cookware that difference is palpable for any application that requires browning and/or very even heat. And if you think about it in terms of ratio it makes good sense. All-Clad stainless has a 2/1 ratio of conductive material to stainless, while Demeyere and Zwilling are giving you close to 3/1. Again, All-Clad isn't saying that 2/1 is some sort of ideal ratio of even heating/response: You gets what they give you. That's all. With Demeyere conical products I think are clearly saying that there IS a general ideal ratio (or at least a minimum amount), of aluminum to ensure even heating while still maintaining some semblance of response. Those of us who have cooked on aluminum of many different thicknesses can attest to this.

Jul 29, 2015
randallhank in Cookware

Demeyere Industry 5 Opinions?

"How does it compare to All-Clad D5?"

I assume you mean for cooking, cleanup, ease of use, and overall quality? I addressed just those issues in my previous post. Other issues, such as visual aesthetic, weight, etc. fall under the realm of personal preference. I did not address those issues.

Jul 29, 2015
randallhank in Cookware
1

Demeyere Industry 5 Opinions?

I was the one who revived this thread recently to discuss a particular topic involving discontinued cookware value. Unfortunately some people see this as an invitation to revisit the OP, and spout off somewhat misleading information on the topic in order to justify their own agenda and bad purchases. I should have anticipated this, and I apologize.

So, for anyone reading this thread in the future, the Industry 5 and identical Zwilling Sensation lines are a superior product to anything that All-Clad makes. This is verified by independent testing, user experience, and common sense. Demeyere Industry 5/Zwilling Sensation offers a thicker conductive core, a Silvinox treated surface, and hand-welded handles. The Zwilling handles are also objectively more comfortable than the All-Clad.

Jul 28, 2015
randallhank in Cookware

Final day tomorrow. Need to decide pots and pans

I would go for the 10 piece Zwilling Sensation set. It will give you two additional sauce pots, another skillet, and a larger stocker for $150. I think it's a better value. You can still get the steamer and saucier without duplicating any sizes.

A Special Gift to A Special Cast Iron Fan

Pretty sure it was always made in China, as is the Tools cookware. The fine glassware they are known for is made in Finland.

Jul 27, 2015
randallhank in Cookware

A Special Gift to A Special Cast Iron Fan

Swedish Thermoclad? Uh I'll take the Sarpeneva.

Jul 26, 2015
randallhank in Cookware

Post your second half 2015 cookware and kitchen deals and finds here.

I got it. I've never seen much good cookware there. I sort of stopped using it post-TJMaxx, as the things I was accustomed to buying there dried up.

Jul 26, 2015
randallhank in Cookware

Demeyere Industry 5 Opinions?

Sorry to revive an old thread, but I found this conversation interesting. Perhaps I am in the minority, but I find it better if a reputable company discontinues a cookware line that I own. It's worse for consumers in general, but not necessarily for me.

Jul 26, 2015
randallhank in Cookware

Post your second half 2015 cookware and kitchen deals and finds here.

Isn't that a brand of motor oil?

Jul 26, 2015
randallhank in Cookware

Post your second half 2015 cookware and kitchen deals and finds here.

I am curious about your deal...

I really like my 24cm Pawson skillet. The Proline thickness translates especially well with the modern Pawson look. It's almost brutalist -- just this really raw, thick piece of aluminum. The handle feels just fine to me, at least in this size. I suspect it would be more of an issue with a larger pan. I have the big sauté as well, but that thing is too heavy to do much without the helper handle, so I have no real issue there either.

Jul 25, 2015
randallhank in Cookware

Post your second half 2015 cookware and kitchen deals and finds here.

Just a little update. I forgot to mention that I spoke with someone pretty knowledgeable at Zwilling the other day (not in CR) and, despite my suspicions, he said there were no plans to discontinue Pawson. My sense form the conversation is that they view Pawson as as much of a flagship line as the Atlantis. From a design perspective, Pawson is in rarified air. I can only think of one or two other cookware lines that get the catalogue/magazine space of Pawson, and I have seen it popping up more on the cooking shows.

He did not correct me when I mentioned that Zwilling Sensation was being discontinued. My sense is that they are going to try to go back to differentiating the two brands, though for the time being Demeyere is making the Aurora line in Belgium. It looks like hand-welded handles will be exclusive to Demeyere branded cookware, but I am not sure where this leave the Industry line in the grand scheme.

Jul 25, 2015
randallhank in Cookware

Post your second half 2015 cookware and kitchen deals and finds here.

I think this was it for Atlantis. I have seen better Staub prices on this site, but there were some good deals that sold out early. I got my loaf pan for $69 last year.

Jul 23, 2015
randallhank in Cookware

More Surprisingly Useful Stuff

photo?

Jul 23, 2015
randallhank in Cookware

Porcelain/stoneware or ECI for casserole dishes? And best 2nd size?

I use the shallow square casseroles all the time. I have a nesting set like these:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Lot-of-3-CORN...

I also like the loaf pan:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Corning-Ware-...

and the round skillet.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Corni...

Jul 23, 2015
randallhank in Cookware

Induction Cooking: Is it really more energy efficient? (US Dept of Energy)

A good point.

Jul 23, 2015
randallhank in Cookware

Induction Cooking: Is it really more energy efficient? (US Dept of Energy)

I am not saying they aren't responsible at all. But I think the level/type of responsibility is different.

Jul 23, 2015
randallhank in Cookware

Induction Cooking: Is it really more energy efficient? (US Dept of Energy)

"It's not incumbent on individual greenies to do research and their own experiments."

Charitably speaking, the "job" of an activist is to raise awareness about a particular cause or issue. They aren't responsible for being right on the particulars.

Jul 23, 2015
randallhank in Cookware

Induction Cooking: Is it really more energy efficient? (US Dept of Energy)

Well, just for the record I think doctors should absolutely be responsible for the advice they give, whether they are doing the research themselves or not. And I think the pharmaceuticals should also be held responsible when they are negligent, or incompetent.

A big difference, though, between a doctor and the aforementioned advocates/activists is that I am paying the doctor for their advice. They are advising me directly in a patient/professional capacity.

The activists are kind of out there, but I am not seeking out their direct help as to how to be more environmentally sound. And I am certainly not paying them. Now if they were to put out a shingle and start directly charging people for their advice, that would be a different story.

And, unfortunately, the government is mostly immune from accountability.

Jul 23, 2015
randallhank in Cookware

Induction Cooking: Is it really more energy efficient? (US Dept of Energy)

I'm just saying there's a big difference between experts and advocates.

Jul 23, 2015
randallhank in Cookware
1

Demeyere proline 9.4 & 11 fry pan lids

http://www.ebay.com/itm/321812095380?...

Happy birthday. I still don't love these lids or the price. I don't believe they will fit both the Atlantis and the Proline snugly. The 28cm Silga lid I linked to is still a better choice. Aside from the fit, it's just a nicer lid.

Jul 23, 2015
randallhank in Cookware