cowboyardee's Profile
Sous vide- I know this has been dealt with a good bit
I hadn't seen that very affordable IC unit from your first link, so thanks for posting it. I'll try to come up with some justification for buying it to try it out.
I'm not sure what you're referring to in the second link though. It just leads to a list of products.
Misono and Masahiro knives
I don't even remember seeing any moritakas in person, so I couldn't tell you. Earlier I was assuming your honesuki was asymmetrical just because it was a honesuki, not because I had any particular insight into how Moritaka grinds his edges in particular.
If I had to guess, I'd say it's likely that the edge on your moritaka had been pretty close to 50-50 with roughly equal edge angles - probably no more than 60-40 and maybe (or maybe not) a mere couple degrees more obtuse on the right side. I'm mainly guessing that because you said you don't remember making any effort to reprofile it and the edge is now 50-50. If I were to grind my honesuki (which is something like 90-10) into a 50-50 edge, it would take quite a bit of work on the one side of the knife - there would be no way I could do it accidentally over the course of two or three sharpenings.
Misono and Masahiro knives
"On a UX10 The angles are about 10-12 degrees right, 20 degrees left, so the total is maybe 30* and the ratio is about 65:35"
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Since this thread has resurfaced, I just want to clarify a thing or two:
For one, Scubadoo is basically right - the ratio refers NOT to the angles of the edge (or even, strictly speaking, to the width of the bevels, though that tends to wind up being more or less accurate anyway) but to the distance the edge is from the front or back of the knife. A 50-50 edge is equa-distant from the front and back sides of the knife, even if each side has a different edge angle (you can do this if you want, though I see no reason to). A 90/10 edge is 90% of the way toward the back side of the knife.
About angles on asymmetrical J-knives - usually the front side of the knife (right side on a right handed knife) is actually at a more obtuse angle than the back side. So an asymmetrical misono might be something like 15 degrees on the right side and 12 degrees on the left. This is not always the case and even if it is there's always a little variation, so you're wise to just check the angle before sharpening, or else use the magic marker trick. But as a general rule, that's how most asymmetrical edges are made.
Misono and Masahiro knives
Might just not have been anywhere near as asymmetrical as my honesuki or scuba's in the first place.
steel knives - can i season them like a wok?
"Yes, the pro j-chef's that I've meet don't do Santokus. It's popular in Japan's tiny kitchens, but they have no idea why westerners with big kitchens use them."
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I think they're popular with home cooks especially because they're short, light, and easy to control. That can be nice when you're working on a small cutting board (as many homecooks do) or have iffy knife skills (again, as many homecooks do). Personally I think there are enough advantages of a gyuto or chefs knife (or chinese cleaver) that pros tend to choose longer blades.
One interesting thing about the popularity of different knives among pro cooks in America is that when I watch professional cooking competitions on TV (Top Chef, Chopped, etc), many of the contestants are using gyutos of one sort or another. The Misono ux10 series seems especially popular, but I've also noticed a decent number of masamotos and macs and hattoris and even the odd hiromoto, etc. This is among Western cooks. But at the same time, I sharpen enough knives for professionals and am friendly with enough professionals that i know that gyutos still aren't super common in American pro kitchens, and that when you do see Japanese knives it's often a Global or Shun. I have a hard time imagining that Hattori is actively sponsoring Western cooks on TV, so I'm not really sure why so many of em are using the kinds of gyutos that are popular among us internet knife knuts. Maybe they look good on camera? Or maybe they're more popular in Western fine dining (which kind of makes sense, since Western fine dining seems to have been fairly influenced by Japanese plating techniques - often relying on precision knife work - over the last few decades)? Or maybe they're more popular among head chefs and chef-owners than they are among the average line cook? Who knows.
Misono and Masahiro knives
As long as the edge is still made up of the core steel, it's no huge deal. That's the only major pitfall. The other stuff is small potatoes in the scheme of things, subtle differences. And if you want to go back to an asymmetrical edge at any point to see if you notice or like the difference, it's not too hard.
How asymmetrical is the blade face of the moritaka honesuki?
My review: CCK KF1402 Cleaver
Thanks for the review, chem. That is one serious hunk of metal. Looks quite blade heavy (no surprise). I look forward to seeing more of your thoughts on it once you've put it through its paces.
Misono and Masahiro knives
I'd probably be a little more hesitant to change a honesuki from an asymmetric bevel to a 50-50 one than your average asymmetrical Japanese knife.
There are a few reasons to be wary of changing asymmetry in a knife too much.
- In some knives this can move the edge away from the fully tempered core steel into the softer cladding. This is also a possibility when working with truly forged knives. In practice, this kind of problem is fairly rare, but in certain knives like, for example, a moritaka honesuki, which has both a lot of asymmetry and a core steel that may be thin or a ground a little iffy, it can become more of a problem. it varies on a case-by-case basis, and you can usually tell if it's a going to be a problem in a clad knife just by careful examination. In a knife that's differentially tempered, it can be hard or impossible to tell.
- As I've said before, keep in mind that most Japanese knives are asymmetrical not just in their edge but over the entire blade. At least hypothetically, the asymmetrical edge bevels follow the asymmetry of the knife as a whole. In a way, a well designed asymmetrical edge can actually help to limit steering, helping you keep your cuts straight and helping food fall away from the edge. Admittedly, in most knives this is pretty subtle and you might never notice a difference. I doubt almost anyone would really notice the functional difference between a 50-50 edge and a 60-40 one, even when the rest of the knife is asymmetrical. But a 90-10 edge will definitely feel different from a 50-50 one. I haven't played with your honesuki specifically, but most have a pronounced asymmetry of the blade face.
- In a honesuki specifically, an extremely asymmetrical edge functions both to make a very thick knife function as though as it's significantly thinner behind the edge and also to help in cuts that are very close to a bone, as you might do when removing a chicken breast and tenderloin from the carcass.
Like I said, in practice you have a decent bit of wiggle room; and the first priority is always in keeping a knife sharp, so if a 50-50 edge helps you do that, that's probably the best bet. But I'm hesitant to change an asymmetrical edge too drastically, especially in a very thick knife or one with a very asymmetrical blade face, just because I feel like the asymmetry is there for a reason.
Store Japanese Water Stones in Water?
Basically, I agree with Chem. A lot of sellers and manufacturers will caution you not to soak stones just so they don't have to deal with returns - they err on the side of caution. I'd also take JBroida's word on how specific stones deal with longer term soaking. I've heard before that low and medium grit king stones can live underwater. As a general guideline, higher grit stones are more problematic. But it always depends on the stone in question. The only stone I've ever left in water for a few days was a cheap 240/1000 combo stone I got on amazon, and that was fine.
If you do decide you want to leave a stone in water, you can try this: soak it for an hour. If it's fine, soak it next time for a few hours. Still fine - soak it for a day. Still fine - soak for a few days. Still fine - you're probably good to go. One last consideration - I've heard there is some potential for mold or fungus when storing underwater. I've also heard stories of people adding just a few drops of bleach to their water to prevent this. But it's not something I've tried.
What's so bad about genetically modified foods?
"I guess what I'm saying is that your referencing a chemical compound that, yes, may be contained in food...but is not actually food"
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What's the relevant difference between a genetically modified vegetable and a genetically modified supplement? In the US, they're both regulated and monitored (poorly) by the FDA. The fact that there has not yet been a mass casualty tied to a genetically modified food doesn't exactly mean that there's no risk of such.
"This is not an issue of genetic alterations running a muck....but instead an entire industry running a muck."
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Granted. GMOs are not the only industrial product that's not adequately tested. But since they increasingly make up a large portion of our diet, doesn't that warrant a little concern?
GMOs aren't the only boogeyman out there; they just happen to be the subject of this particular thread. I'm not opposed at all to scientific advancement, but I do wish that the testing process before an industry could bring said advancements to the general population was more robust (labeling would also be nice, but alas you only get the government that industry pays for).
Here is an article about the dangers of rushing newly modified organisms to the market. It is what it sounds like - the true story of a biotech company flirting with killing all plant life on earth.
http://www.cracked.com/article_18503_how-biotech-company-almost-killed-world-with-booze.html
(yes, I know that some of the article's scientific claims are dubious. Even with that noted, it's still kinda scary. And, if nothing else, the article is pretty funny).
What's so bad about genetically modified foods?
You quoted me talking about small farmers, not the farm business as a whole. Rising price of farmland doesn't exactly prove that small farmers are better off. In fact, this trend has the potential to price smaller farmers out of their own land. The trend of the last century (and the last 40 years especially) has been towards larger farms, with the highest profits coming from those large farms. The largest farms have indeed been increasingly profitable, but that leaves the question of whether owners of small farms can make a living off farming alone or whether they're simply left out in the cold.
This data is already a few years old, but hopefully you can take a look at the graph I posted below. The striking thing about it - for 85% of American farms in 2003, yearly sales from farming average well below $3000. Of course, the pitiful income from farming is supplemented by other incomes by the farmers, but hopefully you can take home the obvious point.
Pizza - why high temperature?
Right off the bat - I should have clarified initially that the recommendation for an aluminum plate was geared toward making a neapolitan style pizza in the home oven. It seems you knew that, but I wanted to point it out for anyone else following along.
Aside from your objection to anyone considering Young or Blumenthal authorities on neapolitan pizza, I'm not sure I fully understand your objection to the method.
- Is it your contention that a slab of steel will work better than aluminum for neapolitan style pizza? For other styles of pizza? Why?
- Or that you simply can't make neapolitan style pizza in a home oven (at least without messing with the self-cleaning cycle)?
- When you use a steel slab as you recommend, do you also recommend using it in conjunction with the broiler?
- You quote some bake times in your original post - limits imposed by the raw dough. Have you managed with any material and/or set up to get a cook time down to around 90 seconds in a home oven? Even with a fully preheated metal slab and my broiler on high, I don't think I've ever gotten the cook time down that low, though admittedly I haven't timed it.
In the interest of disclosure, I haven't tried using aluminum personally; it just makes a kind of intuitive sense to me as a way to push the cook time lower in a home oven (and like I've said above, too-low cooking time is not a problem I've managed to have). I have tried cooking under the broiler on an overturned cast iron griddle (maybe 1/3 inch thick), the seriouseats method of cooking on the stovetop and then under the broiler (in a Lodge cast iron skillet in my case), and a slightly modified version of that method wherein skillet is preheated in the oven to get the sides of the pan hotter before cooking (compensating for the too-steep sides of the skillet). All three methods work better than a pizza stone without the broiler in a home oven.
Pizza - why high temperature?
Modernist Cuisine recommends a thick aluminum plate. What it loses in thermal mass, it makes up for in conductivity. Obviously, it weighs a lot less than a steel plate of similar thickness would.
Both Modernist Cuisine and seriouseats.com recommend using a broiler in conjunction with a preheated metal surface, btw - more intense heat to the pizza, even if the oven temp is no hotter.
Beston 220 grit stone - my first experience
"Clearly if you whack the board with the blade that's going to be problematic as well but that's user error not a caveat of the knife."
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The whacking I referred to earlier was actually related to the knife itself. When you split a winter squash with a thick knife, the wedging factor makes apply more force, so when the squash splits you are more likely to hit the board hard at the end of the stroke. Of course there are ways around this, but i find it easier and more graceful to just cut the squash with a super thin knife that cuts it without a whole lot of force. It actually might be easier to cut a winter squash with a very thick and heavy knife than a moderately thick and heavy one (they both wedge badly, but a thicker knife can split it kind of like firewood and the extra weight can help a little bit), but a super thin knife reliably works the easiest. You're right that twisting the knife is potentially a problem, so I guess I wouldn't recommend it for someone who's got a sloppy stroke. Never chipped my blade on a winter squash though.
Now, celery root, OTOH - never found a great way to cut through that easily.
Beston 220 grit stone - my first experience
Try cutting hard squash rind with the Moritaka and let us know what happens to your edge. ;)
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Funny you should mention - I mainly use an extremely thin, acutely angled knife for winter squash (my yusuke gyuto). Winter squash is actually easier on the edge of that knife than it is on thicker knives because most of the dulling when cutting winter squash seems to come from impact with the cutting board when you're cutting with a lot of force. A thinner knife glides through squash easily enough that I maintain control of the blade and don't wind up whacking the knife or putting a lot of force into the stroke. The problem with cutting winter squash isn't the hardness of its skin - it's how much the knife tends to wedge.
Beston 220 grit stone - my first experience
"I don't think I can mess around this knife too much since it does not belong to me."
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That's my problem too. Aside from my forschner (which is pretty thin behind its edge), I've given away all of my old German style knives at this point, so I don't have any to really experiment on. I could mess around with my Sabatier or that massive old Dexter carbon knife, though both have pretty flat face grinds. I figure maybe I'll find a used German chef knife cheap and give it a try, but no rush.
Beston 220 grit stone - my first experience
"My suspicion is that the steel won't accommodate too much thinning, but I guess I'll find out."
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I don't think it would support a 20 degree included edge like some of the J knives we mess around with, but I fidgure you can still mess around plenty with the secondary bevels, asymmetry, and thinning behind the edge as long as you avoid using it as a meat cleaver.
OTOH, I'm less certain that you wouldn't get more significant steering issues, since the back side of the knife isn't ground like knives that normally have asymmetrical edges.
Beston 220 grit stone - my first experience
Thanks for the review chem.
A couple questions (again):
- Is the knife marked with the kind of steel it uses?
- What kind of edge did you put on the henckels? In other words, did you follow the factory geometry? I've been curious for a while about taking a thicker, German style knife and applying an asymmetrical bevel and then convexing the front side of it a bit and seeing if I could give it both slightly less cutting resistance as well as better food release without experiencing too much steering. Of course, German knives aren't really designed with this in mind, but I'm wondering how much of this you can control just by messing around with the bevels and area right behind the edge on a thicker knife. Haven't bothered to try though, yet.
Beston 220 grit stone - my first experience
Thanks for the review chem. Couple quick questions for you:
- What were you using as a coarse[st] stone before the bester 220?
- How does the bester 220 compare?
- Did you try soaking it for a while to compare? I ask because the bester 500 is weird with respect to soaking. You can soak it for just a couple minutes and it seems ready. And sure enough you can use it like that. But I've found that it just grinds much more aggressively when it's soaked upwards of half an hour, even though the stone outwardly seems ready after a brief soak. Of course, I'm not sure that the 220 has the same qualities as the 500 - very coarse stones are often different from the rest of a maker's lineup.
Interesting side story - I've had three different people bring me henckels international chef knives to sharpen recently (all 8 inch, made in Spain, full bolster). Two of the three wouldn't sharpen worth a damn, while the third took a perfectly serviceable edge. All sharpened to roughly the same angle, all on the same equipment. I figure it must be inconsistency in the heat treatment, but not positive. Also possible they've switched steels a couple times.
Why is the Olive Garden so reviled?
Right off the bat - I don't particularly like OG and I don't enjoy eating there. BUT I don't think their food is objectively of any worse quality than many other casual-dining chains like, say, Friday's or Chili's or Applebees or Red Lobster, etc. And I'd agree that OG tends to be more reviled than other chains making food of similar quality.
Here's my guess at the main reason for this: frankly, American foodies tend to be more dogmatic about Italian food (or even Italian-American food) than American food. A crappy burger is free to just be nothing more significant than a crappy burger, while an entree of overcooked pasta with gluey alfredo sauce and chicken is looked upon as a travesty of sorts. Why is that? I'm not really too sure.
At what age should you let a child handle a kitchen knife to help with food prep? [moved from Home Cooking]]
I think there are probably a lot more factors than that in why more kids are overweight now than in decades past. Off the top of my head - increased amounts of processed foods; higher availability of convenient ready-made foods; low-fat, high sugar 'diet foods'; prevalence of soda, juice and generally sugary drinks as a major contributor to overall calories; a cultural trend where parents became convinced that allowing their children to play outside without direct supervision is dangerous; a trend away from walking even moderate to short distances (which itself has many factors).
Anyway, I like the idea of teaching children basic skills of self-reliance. Self-reliance is important. But I don't think that mandatory home ec class would create a generation of great or even especially competent cooks. Home cooking just isn't valued in American culture by and large, And a class in school doesn't do much to change cultural values.Learning to cook just isn't that hard if you're motivated, and it's kind of futile if you're not motivated. Cultures that do value home cooking have a lot of great home cooks even without home ec class. Whereas, frankly, mandatory American home ec class of the 50s and 60s didn't create an amazing culture of home cooking.
help! my bacon aioli is breaking!
I'm taking a guess here, so correct me if I'm wrong - you're using soy lecithin because you want the aioli to stay emulsified without using eggs (whose own lecithin stabilizes emulsions)?
If so, that's your problem. Lecithin powder doesn't seem to stabilize an emulsion like an egg does. I'm actually not sure why - that's just the way it seems to work. Eggless aioli is not normally a stable emulsion. A more mayo-like, stable emulsion typically contains eggs. You can either add some egg to the mix or use it as is (prone to breaking) or even add something like a little mustard which can also help to stabilize an emulsion (though it isn't foolproof).
If that's not the problem, please list exactly how you made the aioli.
Recommend Japanese waterstones f/ a beginner
"The reason is this: not everyone end up enjoying sharpening like cowboy, you and me...etc. There is always a chance that someone will find knife sharpening is just too much work or too difficult. In light of this possibility, it is safer to not spend too much up front."
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Lameass application of math: we recommend starting with a single $40 stone whereas petek recommends going right on ahead with, say, $160 worth of stones. As such, if the chances are 1 in 4 that the OP will be happy without buying a more premium $160 set in addition to the $40 stone, then our recommendations work out even from a financial perspective. I used to play a lot of poker.
Math aside, I also like starting out with an affordable option for two other reasons. One is that there are some pretty decent affordable options. But the other is that there are a range of options in premium stones and starting off in the shallow end lets you figure out your preferences before spending big money. Examples - I've found that I like to use A LOT of pressure on coarse stones whereas I don't need pristine feedback, and as such the beston 500 is a better option than some other premium coarse stones for me. Likewise, some of my stones spend a lot of time in the trunk of my car, so these stones can't be the type that take many hours or days to dry because I'd worry about em cracking in the winter. Even among premium stones, there are options that take more or less water, that feel harder or softer. And that's putting aside the messy question of what grits you keep in your progression.
All that said, I have several stones I no longer use, and it would've been nice to jump straight to my current picks from the get go. If I had bought choseras or superstones or gesshins right off the bat, I might never have bought others and saved a little money... Maybe.
At what age should you let a child handle a kitchen knife to help with food prep? [moved from Home Cooking]]
If you can cut a brunoise of carrots, you can do square roots. And you already remember pi. Math is delicious.
AGAR VERSUS CARAGEENAN? WHICH MELTS BETTER?
"the only other kind of kosher gelatin i have heard of is from fish bones"
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I had assumed that was what you were talking about. "Kosher gelatin" that's actually carrageenan isn't gelatin.
Are you trying to develop a vegetarian recipe (thus any kind of gelatin, which all comes from meat or fish, won't do)? If so, you can try carrageenan, but like I said, I'm not convinced it would work. The other option would be to simply freeze the liquid and filling before filling the saltenas.
AGAR VERSUS CARAGEENAN? WHICH MELTS BETTER?
I'm not certain I'm understanding you - you want to make an empanada filling that is juicy like a soup dumpling? If that's the case, I suspect you'll have an easier time finding kosher gelatin (it's available online) than getting a similar effect from agar agar or carageenan. The main reason gelatin is used for this kind of thing is its low melting temperature - gelled broth liquefies when cooked and stays liquid as it's served. Agar agar, by contrast, has a very high melting point and a fairly high gelling point. A high melting point means that the internal temperature of the saltena must be raised to at least that point - which might be problematic or difficult. A gelling point much above body temperature is problematic because the liquid will gel again as it's being served unless you expect your food to be eaten burn-your-tongue hot.
Carrageenan melts and gels a little lower than agar agar, but still significantly higher than gelatin. It seems to be a little more variable in gelling and melting temperatures - perhaps a little unpredictable unless you're very familiar with whatever particular carrageenan you're using. Both agar agar and carrageenan have the potential to change the texture/mouthfeel of the broth a little bit as well.
You might be able to make carrageenan work if you're lucky. I haven't used it as much as agar and gelatin, so it's hard to say first hand, and I certainly haven't used it for this kind of application. But I think you'll save yourself some grief by just biting the bullet and buying some kosher gelatin online.
Recommend Japanese waterstones f/ a beginner
I think that's a good strategy. The 1k/6k combo should function well enough to be your only waterstone if you choose. And it's affordable enough to leave your options open for other stones once you develop your own preferences, if you want to try out more stones.
As for flattening: truth is I bought a DMT XXC plate fairly early on when I was learning to sharpen. It works well, so I haven't tried out many alternate strategies. I could imagine potential hazards of flattening on a sidewalk or cinder block - possible grit contamination (a good rinse should fix this though); an uneven surface leading to uneven stones (my biggest worry); large grits or pebbles gouging bits out of your stones (#2 biggest worry); unusually slow progress (I have no idea). That said, you never know until you try. So maybe a little later I'll see how the sidewalk works for flattening a stone I don't much care for (the king 4000 stone seems like a good option). If I do, I'll update.
Recommend Japanese waterstones f/ a beginner
You can take nicks out with a 1000 grit stone.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IiYT3xPNkoE&list=UUi1OKw1BM0Ny4nePaXyE7fg&index=70&feature=plpp_video
(for a good look at the chips he's grinding out, go to 5:10 in this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IiYT3xPNkoE&list=UUi1OKw1BM0Ny4nePaXyE7fg&index=70&feature=plpp_video )
In practice, it'll probably take you a while longer to remove big chips like those. It's definitely not my preferred tool for the job, but you can still manage it with a 1k stone and good technique.
That said, if you are certain you want a coarse stone, your best bet that doesn't cost a fortune would probably be to buy one combo stone and one additional stone to back that up. Even though I haven't tried it, I like the recommendation for the 1/4k combo stone from Japanesechefknives.com - the nice thing about that site is he tends to stock good products, so if the price is right and he says it's not a long-soaking stone, that's not a bad risk to take. You could supplement that with a coarser stone and call it a day. Alternatively, you could buy the 240/1000 grit combo (which really isn't a bad stone) I mentioned in my earlier post and then supplement that with a higher grit finishing stone. Either way, you'd have your bases covered and will have an easy time of repairs once you've got some practice under your belt.
Recommend Japanese waterstones f/ a beginner
A heads up - I am very happy with the king 800, but I have it as part of that combo, and the 4000 grit side is pretty bad. It feels very 'waxy' for lack of a better term, glazes over extremely quickly in use, and is very slow to polish.
Unfortunately, I don't have an ideal alternative recommendation for a combo stone in similar grits.
Recommend Japanese waterstones f/ a beginner
The beston and bester stones are made by the same company and have basically the same qualities in different grits. I have no idea why they call one bester and the other beston. I always forget which is which, but it doesn't really matter much.
Twyst recommended a kickass set, as long as you don't mind the soaking time for the first two stones.
Like chem, I'd have a hard time comparing the king 800 to a sharpmaker grit. In practice, I think the king 800 will be faster once you're good at hand sharpening, but that probably has more to do with the stone width and material than grit size. As for whether you'd need both a bester 500 and a king 800... not necessarily as a beginner. I was suggesting the king 800 as a cheaper and shorter-soak alternative to the bester 500 and 1200. That said, I do have both the king 800 and bester 500, and I use them for different purposes. The king is my basic starting stone for most non-touch up jobs. But it doesn't compare to the cutting power of the bester 500 (which compares well to a lot of lower-grit stones), so I use the bester for major reprofiling jobs... which you probably won't be doing too many of yet.
