OK, back from our trip and here's the report. Spoiler: disappointing, at least. But fun.

THE SUPPER

1. The supper is not served on the terrace, as the web site photos imply. It is now served in a purpose built covered pavilion at the end of a little lane at the chateau end of the garden. If you get a table near the front, you can sort of see the beginning of the garden, but none of the chateau. So no view of the candles, really.

2. We didn't realise it would still be so light at 8:00 pm in July. The outdoor candles we could see were barely noticeable during and for a while after supper!

3. Medium quality restaurant food. Obviously, given the speed with which it was served, mostly pre-prepared. I've just looked at the online menu and rats, I think our menu was somewhat different, so without notes, I can't now remember exactly what we had. But trust me, not worth going out of your way to have as a nice dinner.

However...

THE EXPERIENCE

Our entry ticket for the candlelight visit allowed us to enter at 14:00 (2 pm, right?). So we made a day of it, and the day should have been longer! I had no idea how far away the end of the gardens are from the chateau. It would be an hour's walk, at least, given that one also has to detour around the Canal.

And it is only from the very end of the garden, on the hill of the Hercules statue, that one can really see the whole affair. The gardens are a series of terraces, getting LOWER as you go out. You have to go up on the hill to see all the terraces at once. Interesting. We could have rented one of the little electric golf carts and gotten out there, but by the time we rode the train from Paris, got the bus, looked through the chateau in daylight to be able to compare to the candlelight, and THEN walked through the gardens down as far as the canal and Cascade Fountain, while the fountains played, oops, time to go back to supper!

And then retour the chateau in candlelight after supper.

Loie and I enjoyed our day there immensely. Having the sit down supper was actually just the thing to help make it a full, rich day. If we had realized the extent of the gardens, we would have arrived earlier, at the stroke of 2:00 pm. Had thorough touring, eaten a nice --but not spectacular-- supper, and done the candlelight walking reasonably well fed.

I'll be happy to answer any questions about the actual meal, after looking over our pictures. And any other questions!

Ah, I'm sorry! I see that "Martel, Lacave, Marcilhac sur Célé" are indeed in the Lot DEPARTMENT, although they are on or near the Dordogne RIVER. That's my confusion! As we'll be staying in Puy L'Eveque, west of Cahors, I guess although places like that are in our Department, they're also kind of far afield to pop out to for dinner. But maybe we need to plan a few day trips up there to see the countryside!

Thank you Parigi.

Ok, I've been scouring the board and found an interesting phenomenon. There is little or nothing here about places in the Lot Valley. Plenty of Dordogne and north (Perigordian, I think) but nothing Quercy, until down in Toulouse or so. If that is indeed stil Quercy. Apparently the Lot and Tarn are the orphans of Chowhound gastronomical knowledge!

Or maybe I'm missing something!

Off to the UK and France on Wednesday. Thanks to all who have posted.

Thank you all. I'm compiling!

Thank you, Sunshine, for that tip. We'll keep in mind to avail ourselves of taxi. Now, let's just hope for "Sunshine" on our day!

We'll be a week in Puy L'Eveque (west of Cahors) this July. Soon!

I'm winkling a few recommendations out of other threads here, but wonder if any Hounds would have time to make a sort of Formal List here? We'd like to hear about both sitdown lunch and dinners, and picnic supplies. Any recommendations or warnings greatly appreciated!

Bucky Edgett

Well, thanks to all who responded. We'll not have a car in Paris. I think during our trip time (July) the chateau runs shuttle buses to the train. So we'll be kind of "stuck at" the chateau once we get there. So lemarais, we're hoping this all works out!

I've booked us two seats for dinner, hoping for the best, and willing to accept less just because it's such a silly idea. One thing that decided us is that on that Saturday, the fountains will be operating in the late afternoon. If there's been enough rain to fill the chateau reservoir! Yikes! And, a candlelight visit entry ticket can be used from 2:00 pm on to enter the grounds & chateau.

So we can wander the gardens in the afternoon, have a dinner while the candles are being lighted, and tour the chateau by candlelight after dinner. Hope that works!

This may be a stretch, but I think Bud's at Silver Run ( http://www.budsatsilverrun.com/ ) is still open. They were French/American style when we last went. Worth a look, I'd say.

Goldberg's are the same as all the modern bagels: fluffy, almost no crust and not nearly salty enough. Bland as white bread. Matter of fact, they ARE white bread. But so are everyone else's. Real bagels seem to be a thing of the past. ::sigh::

Well, I haven't been there in some years/decades, but sorry, in its hayday, the Cozy was nothing like a "hospital cafeteria." The butter, salt and chicken fat would have sent any self respecting cafeteria manager into fibrillation. And not from actually eating, just thinking about it. I remember it as described by Querencia: a mix of Pennsylvania Dutch and Maryland style home cooking on a huge scale. Has it become modernly health conscious? That would be a shame.

Are there any? Goldberg's, although nice, are not what I'm looking for. Old fashioned bagels, as in: chewy, you could hardly bite them apart. Dense, not fluffy. Thicker crust, more crunchy.

All the bagels just seem weak and uninteresting. May be a wild goose chase!

Thanks!
Bucky Edgett

Dear JMF,

I'm corresponding with some folks who might be able to provide contemporary documentation on "aloes," which they claim were indeed the aloes-wood, as you claim. Neato!

Would you care to share your documentation with us, or is it a secret?

Yours,
Bucky

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ucNYLs...

Douglas Adams' take on an at least similar idea, from "The Restaurant at the End of the Universe," copyright 1980.

Is macaroni & cheese a trend? Interesting.

The gluey problem comes, I think, from most people using a milk or cream sauce in it. That's a mistake. But it, by association with a bisque, probably suggests the lobster.

See http://lovebunnies.luckypro.biz/01_st... for a good recipe. Use a heavy baking dish/casserole to get the bottom crust. No thin aluminum foil things! A pan of this at the pot luck never goes begging.

Dear JMF,

Short answer: as yet no actual reference to pods being used. I'm out of my depth here!
Picture of a seed pod of A. hirta"
https://sites.google.com/a/gaharu.biz/www/species-of-agarwood-or-gaharu
A mention of the "little tents" seed pods of some kind of "aloe/agar-wood" species without a species ID:
http://aromatherapy.homestead.com/Spi...
This text is cribbed on several different sites, without any elucidation or references.

Post's list of ingredients isn't exactly the same as Scott's. Post omits orange rind and coffe beans, and substitutes granulated for lump sugar. Their descriptions of the making differ slightly.
But you're right, "aloes" is common to both. Intriguing!

I'm pretty much stumped. The Internet is letting me down! I think we need someone down at Tulane with access to period original source documents to research exactly what "aloes" would have been.

Ha ha! I may be on to something. Beginning to suspect JMF and I are correct, AND incorrect. This is a tangled web, but a certain strand may be emerging.

Aquilaria malaccensis is the tree whose fungus-infected heartwood produces the incredibly expensive and now technically illegal Oud resin perfume. The tree is known colloquially as Agarwood, Aloewood, Eaglewood and Lign-aloes.

However, there is ANOTHER tree, Aquilaria agallocha which is ALSO called Lign-aloes. It is much more common. It has seed pods that are supposedly fragrant.

So I'm wondering if the much less expensive pods of the latter were once sold as spice? THAT would explian the reference to "4" of them. Hmmm?

Sloe gin? Are the berries only for color? Don't think I've ever tried sloe gin!

Emily Post's column lists aloes, as well. Difficult to believe two people would have had the same mistake, unless of course she or someone was copying Natalie Scott without really knowing what was being described.

Okay, we need some deeper research into "aloes" in old time recipes. I'm not coming up with much!

Loie and I are intrigued by the idea. Does anyone know if the food is good? Thanks!

Dear Wyogal,

I've only posted it once. But a thread with an association of sloes and coffee would be interesting!

Dear JMF,

Yes, thanks, I read about the aloe incense. ..."myrhh and aloes..." is a Biblical quotation; came up in thousands of hits during my Google searching.

But it can't be the solution to my mystery. Natalie Scott's recipe specifically calls for "4 aloes." Not 4 drops of aloe, or 4 somethings of aloe, just "4 aloes."

Many of her and Mandy's recipes are a bit lax on quantities. Some of them are positively sloppy! So if Ms. Scott specified 4 of something, that something has to have been something that comes as discreet items. Sloes are berries, of which one could obtain 4. The aloewood spice might have come in discreet units or pieces or items or nuggets. But really, "4 sloes" just makes so much more sense as a measure than does "4 aloe(wood)s."

I'm looking for sloes! Thanks again.

Drongo, you're a genius! Sloe Gin Fizz is a signature New Orleans cocktail. The original recipe MUST have called for sloes. Yes! Chowhound comes through again. It doesn't seem that Google has digitized any early editions of either Mandy or 200 Years, and at $50 bucks used I have to pass. So no way at the moment to check when the mistake occured.

But I'm sure you've cracked the case. Thanks Immensely!

I'm pretty sue I'm NOT talking about aloe vera.

Natalie Scott's <i>200 Years of New Orleans Cooking</i> has a recipe for Cafe Brulot that calls for 4 aloes:
"...
4 all-spice
2 cloves
8 lumps of sugar
6 parched whole coffee beans
4 aloes
..."

It seems they should be some kind of spice/flavoring/I have no idea. I've googled to no avail. It might be possible she was talking about chunks or leaves of aloe vera, but that just doesn't seem likely to me.

Any thoughts on this obscure topic would be greatly appreciated!

Bucky Edgett

Hello, Maureen! This is a fun thread. The last paragraph ("fine crystal") is my favorite. Loie likes to have lunch at the Enoteca Capranica. I have no idea if it's on anyone's list of good places in Rome, but we just like sitting there and having the service and the --by me, always tasty-- food. Costs an arm and a leg, but once every few years, what the heck!

Bucky Edgett

Garvick's country ham. 5252 Band Hall Hill Rd; Westminster, MD 21158; (410) 848-0067

If that is still a good phone number. Call and ask Nevin for one of his country hams.

It's worked for me, sort of. But I used several raw white potatoes, sliced. Not a whole one, and not a baking potato. Reduced the saltiness of a broth made from country ham. Didn't **eliminate** the salt, but did reduce it.

Adding this to the list strictly for historical atmosphere, as I assume no one would even think of recreating it...

Sharing the half gallon of Cribari that had been used in the --ahem-- water pipe for several months. First semester sophomore year, fall 1970, Brown University, Providence, RI.

***Kids, don't try this at home!***

"PGA Punch." (Pure Grain Alcohol, sold as such.) Hosts provide the case of fiths of PGA. Guests bring the mixers: any kind of fruit juice, mixers, soda pop, you name it. Dump all the mixers in a semi-clean trash can and start pouring in fifths of PGA. See how long it takes the drunken fools to dare each other into adding the whole case of PGA to the punch, and what truly idiotic fools will still drink it.

Willingly second a general vote of thanks to this board!

OK, I get it. We'll make that a possible lunch or cocktails stop.

So, if the Ancient and Honourable Institution of Friday Lunch has degenerated at Galatoires, who still upholds it?

-----
Galatoire's Restaurant
209 Bourbon St., New Orleans, LA 70130