A Meaty, Boozy Father's Day
Polynesian Cocktail Party
10 Spicy Snacks
Party Food from the Corner Store
How to Make Nut Milk
Sausage Recipes of the Month
Dear Helena,
When I'm a houseguest for a short period of time (two or three days), I buy at least one dinner and usually one breakfast as well—it seems like a nice hospitality thank-you, and it's a lot cheaper than staying in a hotel. If I'm somewhere for longer, probably two to three meals plus some kind of formal gift at the end (nice chocolates, wine, etc.).
Is this just me, or is this conventionally accepted behavior? I ask because we had two friends out interviewing at med schools, they stayed with us for three nights and didn't so much as get us flowers, and I was miffed, particularly since we'd bought them a nice dinner when we'd stayed with them for an equivalent stay. But maybe I have no right to be miffed. What do you think?
—Feeling Used
Dear Feeling Used,
You're right: If a guest stays overnight at your home, a mere "Thank you" isn't enough. The generally accepted rule, which I ascertained via an informal poll on Facebook, is that the guest should take the host out for a meal. And how much should he spend? To put it crudely, the answer depends on how much money you both make.
If you just made partner in your law firm and your guest is a struggling musician, then it's enough if he takes you to breakfast. But if you're the broke one, and your rich lawyer buddy comes to stay, he'd better pony up for a nice steak dinner. As a rule of thumb, one meal is sufficient recompense for a long weekend. But if you're putting someone up for four days or more, he should offer to take you out a second time.
The guest shouldn't insist on treating you by cooking at your house. It's not much of a treat if you have to answer a bunch of questions like, "Where do you keep the soy sauce?" Interestingly, offering to cook a meal in someone's home would be unthinkably intrusive in many other cultures. In China, says Jonathan Lipman, a professor of Asian studies at Mount Holyoke College, "The home kitchen is extremely private space, belonging to the granny, to the adults in the household, or to the servants ... so a guest would be way out of line even to propose such a thing." It's the same in Japan, says Tara Austen Weaver, a writer who lived there for five years. A Japanese host won't even allow the guest to help clear dishes, let alone cook.
A host gift is nice—especially if it's homemade and edible—but it's not required. For one thing, it's not always practical. These days a guest can't bring a bottle of wine in his carry-on baggage, and there may not be a good wine store near you.
The reason a guest ought to show appreciation, of course, is that hosting someone is hard work. You have to stock your refrigerator, wash the sheets, and perhaps pick up your guest from the airport. But people in their early twenties don't always realize this. After all, it was only recently that their parents were doing their grocery shopping and laundry. Case in point: A friend of mine in her late thirties recently hosted a twentysomething friend at her home. He didn't offer to take her out for breakfast, and worse still, he polished off an entire box of Samoa Girl Scout cookies stashed in her freezer. When she expressed mild irritation, he responded as if she were his mom: "Can't you just buy some more?"
As aspiring med students, your friends may not have the cash to treat you to a tasting menu at your local James Beard–nominated restaurant, but they should definitely spring for coffee and pancakes. If they're past their twenties, they're officially old enough to know better.
I like how my husband and I agree to deal with this matter with our Japanese friends. We negotiate the whole deal in advance. Gifting is fine but needs to be inexpensive -- best to have that gift reflect where we currently lived like pure maple syrup, even UofM clipboards! If we're in Japan, our hosts pay for everything. However, when they come to the States, we pay for everything. And we do keep...+READ
I like how my husband and I agree to deal with this matter with our Japanese friends. We negotiate the whole deal in advance. Gifting is fine but needs to be inexpensive -- best to have that gift reflect where we currently lived like pure maple syrup, even UofM clipboards! If we're in Japan, our hosts pay for everything. However, when they come to the States, we pay for everything. And we do keep in mind the cost of living expenses. So for every one trip to Japan, it's three trips to our place. That way, our friends are comfortable... and we don't worry.
Having been a starving medical student, I know that finances are tight. HOWEVER... I still think not doing something was extremely rude. Everyone knows I'm an excellent chef, and my gifting usually means one or two really great meals at home as well as participating in kitchen detail. (It's still more fun to help out and chat at the same time.) Ingenuity and improvisation are important skills in the medical world -- especially in emergency medicine -- and there is no way this couple couldn't have done something.
I'd just not invite them over again. Or better yet, I'd do something my father-in-law did to discourage a family of five who seemed to conveniently come over just in time for dinner without warning. After the meal, he put the dishes on the floor, allowed the family dog to lick them clean, then restocked the cabinet. He explained that their dishwasher had broken down a month prior, and this seemed to be a better means of dealing with the situation. After all -- "A dog's mouth is cleaner than a human's!" (Technically... it depends... but still! Gross!!)
Suffice it to say, that family never, ever showed up again on the doorstep.-COLLAPSE
We've had many people (mostly family) stay with us this past summer. In addition to hosting them for more than one week each, we've taken them on weekend getaways, cooked beautiful meals eaten outdoors, plus all the usual cleaning & tidying up.
Surprisingly, the only guest to show any gratitude was our seven-year-old niece who brought us hostess gifts, painted a picture for us & then sent a...+READ
We've had many people (mostly family) stay with us this past summer. In addition to hosting them for more than one week each, we've taken them on weekend getaways, cooked beautiful meals eaten outdoors, plus all the usual cleaning & tidying up.
Surprisingly, the only guest to show any gratitude was our seven-year-old niece who brought us hostess gifts, painted a picture for us & then sent a thank-you note. And she did it joyfully. The other guests did nada. Nothing. Verbal "thank-yous" were rarely forthcoming as well. Makes me less inclined to host them in the future, but they are family.-COLLAPSE
So my sis in law and her brat kit self invited themselve for a week...i am sure she won't buy any meals or gifts because she didn't last year.
Call me crazy for preparing all the meals and cleaning up for them..while she talks about how her son only eats organic food.
Inviting someone to your home, whether for a party or a weekend, is not a invitation for quid pro quo. The invitation is a generous act and the only "requirement" is that you respond yes, unless you cannot due to a previous engagement or other impossible logistical hurdles.
It is very nice of the invitee to give a gift at the end of stay, and/or offer to pay for a meal or two. I just don't...+READ
Inviting someone to your home, whether for a party or a weekend, is not a invitation for quid pro quo. The invitation is a generous act and the only "requirement" is that you respond yes, unless you cannot due to a previous engagement or other impossible logistical hurdles.
It is very nice of the invitee to give a gift at the end of stay, and/or offer to pay for a meal or two. I just don't like how this article reads like the invitor expects "payment" in return for being generous. That doesn't make sense.-COLLAPSE
Trying to remember if we sprang for the fish & chips carry-out we ate at friends' a few years ago. We did give the kids cowboy hats (we lived in TX at the time). I'm sure I should've paid for more--DS was whiney and wet the bed every single night we were there. Found out later he had a broken bone in his foot. Still, explaining it doesn't make it any less of a pain. They seem to have recovered,...+READ
Trying to remember if we sprang for the fish & chips carry-out we ate at friends' a few years ago. We did give the kids cowboy hats (we lived in TX at the time). I'm sure I should've paid for more--DS was whiney and wet the bed every single night we were there. Found out later he had a broken bone in his foot. Still, explaining it doesn't make it any less of a pain. They seem to have recovered, as they have recently been asking us to come to their summer place.-COLLAPSE
I can't imagine NOT bringing a gift. We just spent the weekend with friends at their beautiful shore home....I put together a gift basket with their favorite gin....some fun martini glasses...coasters and bar snacks....Then at the end of the stay...after i stripped the bed and folded the sheets I left a thank you note along with a nice soap set....Maybe it is our age????
This is news to me. I'd be delighted if a house guest offered to buy me a meal, but I wouldn't be upset if they didn't. When I was in school, I'd usually send a thank you card to friends who hosted me b/c I didn't have much money. Now that I'm out of school and working, I'll send a card and a small gift once I get back home.
An interesting (to me anyway) insight into how much our society has changed is that several decades back, the host would never dream of allowing a house-guest pay for a meal. "Hosting" meant that you paid for all the meals and, if you elected to eat out during the visit, you paid for that, too. You wouldn't want it to appear that you were suggesting going out to a restaurant as a way to shirk...+READ
An interesting (to me anyway) insight into how much our society has changed is that several decades back, the host would never dream of allowing a house-guest pay for a meal. "Hosting" meant that you paid for all the meals and, if you elected to eat out during the visit, you paid for that, too. You wouldn't want it to appear that you were suggesting going out to a restaurant as a way to shirk your hosting duties by trying to get out of either doing the work, or paying for the food for your guests. It would have been considered to be rude to the max. As though you were saying, "You're too much work and too much money for me to entertain in my home, so let's go out for the meal and I want you to pay."
Times have changed, though, and even Miss Manners now says that if the host says, "Oh no, I'll pay," you shouldn't believe him. That's an old rule that has dropped by the wayside.
It's nice to go out, and it's nice for the houseguest to offer to pick up the check. I lament the loss of many of the older, more gracious and mannerly ways of doing things, but this isn't one of them.
And then the guest would send you a lovely thank-you note, and a very nice hostess gift, and invite you back to their home sometime in order to reciprocate.-COLLAPSE
My thank-you gift: I've been hosting a 20-something in my apt for a week while he's been looking for an apt in NYC. He went out and drank too much one night and puked on my antique rug. I've had that rug for 8 years without a spot on it. Instead of owning up to puking, he told me he'd spilled some food on it while I was out (but you know when you smell puke though, right?). He tried to clean it...+READ
My thank-you gift: I've been hosting a 20-something in my apt for a week while he's been looking for an apt in NYC. He went out and drank too much one night and puked on my antique rug. I've had that rug for 8 years without a spot on it. Instead of owning up to puking, he told me he'd spilled some food on it while I was out (but you know when you smell puke though, right?). He tried to clean it with vinegar and spot remover, which created a bigger mess. He found an apt and is moving out today. Shall I tell him I'm on to what he did?-COLLAPSE
Absolutely agree... I'm in my early 20's, and I grew up seeing my parents always take hosts out, and usually get taken out when people stayed with us. I do agree though that it really depends on income: my friends and I are all either in college/grad school or just out, and for the most part are pretty broke. When I visit friends I try to bring a gift (like a pound of a roast I think they'd like...+READ
Absolutely agree... I'm in my early 20's, and I grew up seeing my parents always take hosts out, and usually get taken out when people stayed with us. I do agree though that it really depends on income: my friends and I are all either in college/grad school or just out, and for the most part are pretty broke. When I visit friends I try to bring a gift (like a pound of a roast I think they'd like from a local coffee shop, nice tea, or if I'm not flying, some homemade goodies), and then make a meal while I'm there. A friend stayed with me for a few days who I know is literally broke, and I appreciated so much that she did the dishes while I was at work - which is what she could afford. It's not about money spent, but just basic consideration.-COLLAPSE
When I stay at a friend's house for 2 or 3 nights I bring a host gift, yes, but in lieu of taking them out to dinner I leave a thank you note with a gift card ($50) for a local restaurant. We don't always go out for meals together (mostly they cook meals for us at home).
I just cant imagine staying at someone's place and NOT buying them a dinner and leaving a nice little card and thank you gift. That is definitely what any well brought up person would insist on doing. It is a LOT of work having guests in your home - those same guests would be springing easily $150 a night for a room- why on earth wouldn't you give them a little break and take them out - this is...+READ
I just cant imagine staying at someone's place and NOT buying them a dinner and leaving a nice little card and thank you gift. That is definitely what any well brought up person would insist on doing. It is a LOT of work having guests in your home - those same guests would be springing easily $150 a night for a room- why on earth wouldn't you give them a little break and take them out - this is not the place to be a cheap skate - they are your friends!!!!-COLLAPSE
I agree with kylemac and Isobel here. I would never expect a guest of mine to bring a present or pay for meals etc. If they offer I would insistently and politely refuse and remind them that they are guests in my house.
But then again I have traveled many countries and found that hospitality rules vary quite a lot from one country to another. Based on my experiences it is my belief that the...+READ
I agree with kylemac and Isobel here. I would never expect a guest of mine to bring a present or pay for meals etc. If they offer I would insistently and politely refuse and remind them that they are guests in my house.
But then again I have traveled many countries and found that hospitality rules vary quite a lot from one country to another. Based on my experiences it is my belief that the richer and more industrialized a society is the more 'formal' the hospitality rules become.
I know for a fact that in some Eastern European countries even if a guest so much as offered to pay for a meal the host would be very offended.-COLLAPSE
Don't forget the thank you letter. And reciprocating hospitality in the future. Other social obligations of being a guest that are often neglected these days; the hostess gift does not dis-oblige one from them....
Kylemac and Isobel -social vampirism is a crime. It is also an epidemic disease among the hipster generation. There is a generational ethic where 'pursuing your art' (and the attendant 'being broke') makes it OK to accept friend's hospitality without thought of making a gesture of gratitude in return. In the mind of hipsterus americanus putting them up for a night or feeding them a meal is akin...+READ
Kylemac and Isobel -social vampirism is a crime. It is also an epidemic disease among the hipster generation. There is a generational ethic where 'pursuing your art' (and the attendant 'being broke') makes it OK to accept friend's hospitality without thought of making a gesture of gratitude in return. In the mind of hipsterus americanus putting them up for a night or feeding them a meal is akin to dropping five bucks in their kickstarter account. Being of an age where weekend getaways typically combine responsible types and cretins under the same roof this concern is not theoretical to me. Friendship, like most other relationships, is not a compact written in stone. It is dependent on generous and thoughtful behavior observed on all sides through the years. This is why certain friends fall by the wayside - shared values are a knife that cuts both ways.-COLLAPSE
@kylemac...it is not so black and white. I love having them out here, but they are the ones doing the asking and arranging. All say they never want to leave when the visit is over. They take pix of the food I serve them. We all have a lovely time. I just want to share the load in a more organized fashion...otherwise I spend most of my time serving rather than visiting. Am I whining? ya...I guess...+READ
@kylemac...it is not so black and white. I love having them out here, but they are the ones doing the asking and arranging. All say they never want to leave when the visit is over. They take pix of the food I serve them. We all have a lovely time. I just want to share the load in a more organized fashion...otherwise I spend most of my time serving rather than visiting. Am I whining? ya...I guess I'm starting to. Thank you's and their company have been enough for 3 years thank you very much!! Now I need some pampering...lol It's no big deal. Friends we will remain regardless. I asked for advice however, your tone was tight with criticism that wasn't helpful at all. thanks for all other thoughtful responses however! :) Indeed lots to think about, so thanks....I would never hurt their feelings.-COLLAPSE
Mountaincachers has put it very well. There are two kinds of overnight guests: those who come to visit their hosts and those who are basically using their home as a free hotel room while in the area for other reasons. If it's the first, presumably shared meals are part of your visit socializing with your friends, and picking up a meal tab (or buying groceries) is no different than what you would...+READ
Mountaincachers has put it very well. There are two kinds of overnight guests: those who come to visit their hosts and those who are basically using their home as a free hotel room while in the area for other reasons. If it's the first, presumably shared meals are part of your visit socializing with your friends, and picking up a meal tab (or buying groceries) is no different than what you would do when sharing several meals with friends at home. If you are treating someone's house like a hotel, then you definitely shouldn't make them feel as if they are nothing more than an innkeeper!-COLLAPSE
Seems like another comment was eaten....
I would be ashamed of MYSELF if I expected a friend to pay for a meal/buy me a present for accepting my hospitality.
If your friend's company and "thank you" are not enough, then you should reconsider calling them "friend" and reterm them "lodger".
Aartist, I can't imagine people not being willing to strip a bed or help clean up the kitchen while they are staying with you. This is not like being invited to dinner where the host may or may not want help. On the other hand, they are guests and tokyo does make a good point about hospitality. You are clearly an extremely hospitable host, you guests however do not seem to be very well mannered...+READ
Aartist, I can't imagine people not being willing to strip a bed or help clean up the kitchen while they are staying with you. This is not like being invited to dinner where the host may or may not want help. On the other hand, they are guests and tokyo does make a good point about hospitality. You are clearly an extremely hospitable host, you guests however do not seem to be very well mannered if they don't even offer help.
I used to have a friend on one of the neighbor islands, and when I or my friends went to visit him we always showed up with groceries. We always insisted on doing most of the cooking, although he always enjoyed welcoming us with a delicious meal the first night. And we always left having cleaned our room, stripping the bed, cleaning the bathroom, etc. We also cooked enough to put a fair amount of leftovers in his freezer.
We always ended up having a lot of fun together, we got free lodging, and he had leftovers to eat and remember our visit. A win win for everyone. Sadly not everyone sees things that way.-COLLAPSE
doing things for your host is also a good way to show gratitude - especially doing the dishes! buying some groceries is another option if restaurant meals are out of your budget.
This is a bizarre and modern take on "hospitality". It used to be (for many many centuries) that individuals hosted travelers in their home out of awareness of the simple fact that a roof over your head and a simple meal is a basic necessity of life. I wonder if the thought that "work" (horrors!) was involved ever crossed their minds as something for which to be compensated. How terribly...+READ
This is a bizarre and modern take on "hospitality". It used to be (for many many centuries) that individuals hosted travelers in their home out of awareness of the simple fact that a roof over your head and a simple meal is a basic necessity of life. I wonder if the thought that "work" (horrors!) was involved ever crossed their minds as something for which to be compensated. How terribly ungracious to expect that your "hospiatlity" shopuld be repaid by anything more than a sincere Thank You, the universal expression of gratitude.-COLLAPSE
@danna - I think a gift is great in many cases. If I were staying with someone for more than a few days I would probably at least offer a meal or two out. I usually bring a gift though. Like last time I visited a friend who had just had a new baby, I was there for 2 days and we had plans for most of the time I was there. So I put together a gift basket with stuff like coffee(her husband is a huge...+READ
@danna - I think a gift is great in many cases. If I were staying with someone for more than a few days I would probably at least offer a meal or two out. I usually bring a gift though. Like last time I visited a friend who had just had a new baby, I was there for 2 days and we had plans for most of the time I was there. So I put together a gift basket with stuff like coffee(her husband is a huge coffee person), tea, cookies/snacks, etc with a few things for the baby and even the dog! They loved it. It depends on what the plans are. The med students need to pony up for a dinner at least, since they are staying at someone's house instead of paying for a hotel. I'm a grad student too and would definitely do that.-COLLAPSE
I have a few friends who often come for a one or two night stay with us in the country. We feed them (I'm a foodie and love to cook) put them up in a nice guest room and clear the decks up front so we can visit. I would say some have been here 10 times. With on exception, no one has brought food or a gift or reciprocated with a nice dinner either at a restaurant or at their place (in the city)....+READ
I have a few friends who often come for a one or two night stay with us in the country. We feed them (I'm a foodie and love to cook) put them up in a nice guest room and clear the decks up front so we can visit. I would say some have been here 10 times. With on exception, no one has brought food or a gift or reciprocated with a nice dinner either at a restaurant or at their place (in the city). Often a bottle of wine is brought, but that's about it. I love them all but lately I feel like a free b&b or rest home. The only thing I asked is that the place looks the same as when they arrived. (bed stripped, dishes done, etc which never happens) (one friend has health issues and often sleeps for the whole weekend.) lol We live waaaaaay out in the country so staying over night is great for all. I'm at the point however that I'm considering charging for meals and bedroom. I wonder how many would still come. hmmm. Sad thought. Am I wrong to feel this way with 'best' friends?-COLLAPSE
Re: "As for a lawyer who just made partner expecting to be taken to breakfast by a struggling friend - that would make that person a jerk, frankly. Seriously - what kind of a person sits there being wealthy and expects struggling friends to buy them things?- By Isobel_A on June 29, 2011 01:24 AM"
The point here is that the lawyer can always pick up the tab for his broke friend. But it's bad...+READ
Re: "As for a lawyer who just made partner expecting to be taken to breakfast by a struggling friend - that would make that person a jerk, frankly. Seriously - what kind of a person sits there being wealthy and expects struggling friends to buy them things?- By Isobel_A on June 29, 2011 01:24 AM"
The point here is that the lawyer can always pick up the tab for his broke friend. But it's bad form if the struggling artist doesn't at least make an offer to do anything.
I've had money and I've had no money. Doesn't change one's ability to be gracious.-COLLAPSE
@Monica - it's your house. YOUR house. "No, that doesn't work for me" should suffice. If she keeps asking, just keep saying it. My own mother put up with this crap from a lousy relative who used to stay with us for weeks on end until finally she just said hell no.
I agree with always bringing a hostess gift. I think paying for dinner depends a lot on the situation. If someone is making a trip specifically to visit me, they may have already spent a good amount on airplane tickets and travel to get here. It's a nice gesture to pay for dinner, but I certainly don't expect it. On the other hand, if someone is staying at my house so that they don't have to pay...+READ
I agree with always bringing a hostess gift. I think paying for dinner depends a lot on the situation. If someone is making a trip specifically to visit me, they may have already spent a good amount on airplane tickets and travel to get here. It's a nice gesture to pay for dinner, but I certainly don't expect it. On the other hand, if someone is staying at my house so that they don't have to pay for a hotel, it's entirely a different situation. It sounds like the friends in the letter were not there primarily as a social visit, but for a free place to stay while they went to interviews. I realize they probably don't have a lot of money, but they should be offering to pay for a meal sometime during their stay.-COLLAPSE
I totally agree with the author of this article. Somewhere along the lines the younger generations have lost the concept of being a good house guest. I guess there is some rational to them being labeled the "Me" generation. But they are not totally to blame. A good hard look at their parents might be in order. This is true with respect to a lot of other situations where one should be thankful and...+READ
I totally agree with the author of this article. Somewhere along the lines the younger generations have lost the concept of being a good house guest. I guess there is some rational to them being labeled the "Me" generation. But they are not totally to blame. A good hard look at their parents might be in order. This is true with respect to a lot of other situations where one should be thankful and not take things for granted. It's called manners!-COLLAPSE
At least if the guest is a friend, you can end the friendship but it's worse if it's your in laws. My sis in law brings her spoiled young son every summer and stays over at my house because she doesn't want to stay over at her own mom who lives near us.
She doesn't bring or buy anything...
"I think it's a shame we seem to be moving towards a society that thinks being friends with someone absolves one of the responsibility to be polite and considerate." -- Exactly, edwardspk! That's the point that the "I wouldn't charge my friends" people are missing. I'm sure Feeling Used feels "miffed" not because she expected to be "repaid" but because her friends were unappreciative and...+READ
"I think it's a shame we seem to be moving towards a society that thinks being friends with someone absolves one of the responsibility to be polite and considerate." -- Exactly, edwardspk! That's the point that the "I wouldn't charge my friends" people are missing. I'm sure Feeling Used feels "miffed" not because she expected to be "repaid" but because her friends were unappreciative and inconsiderate. Real friends don't make their friends feel like all they are is owners of a free place to crash when they happen to be in town.-COLLAPSE
I have been guilty of not buying my hosts dinner. I ALWAYS bring a hostess gift (wine glasses/decanter/soaps/etc) and a bottle of wine or two and usually some homemade treats...but not always a dinner. Do you guys think that's sufficient?
Totally agree with Helena's advice here (with the exception of not expecting it from 20-somethings). When I was young and still living with my parents, if I stayed at a friends house, Mom would make sure I had a gift to take. When I was in high school and college, if I went out of town and stayed overnight with friends, my parents made sure I had money and explained it was to take my hosts out to...+READ
Totally agree with Helena's advice here (with the exception of not expecting it from 20-somethings). When I was young and still living with my parents, if I stayed at a friends house, Mom would make sure I had a gift to take. When I was in high school and college, if I went out of town and stayed overnight with friends, my parents made sure I had money and explained it was to take my hosts out to dinner. They trained me that it was the polite and considerate thing to do. And that buying a meal did not replace a follow-up thank you note, either. I think it's a shame we seem to be moving towards a society that thinks being friends with someone absolves one of the responsibility to be polite and considerate.-COLLAPSE
I agree with the above, but will say that in some ways I feel that it depends on how close I am with the friends who are staying with me. For my closest friends, I certainly don't expect them to take me out, and wouldn't be offended if they didn't (though sometimes they do). To me, thats part of the privilege of really close friendship -- knowing that just the pleasure of each other's company is...+READ
I agree with the above, but will say that in some ways I feel that it depends on how close I am with the friends who are staying with me. For my closest friends, I certainly don't expect them to take me out, and wouldn't be offended if they didn't (though sometimes they do). To me, thats part of the privilege of really close friendship -- knowing that just the pleasure of each other's company is present enough.-COLLAPSE
Miffed? Why not pro-rate the electric bill for the time they were there and have them pay.
I'm frequently too broke to even take friends out for fast food, but I'll usually bring something for them when I visit (even if I'm not staying overnight, something I generally only do if I drink too much to drive home). Herbs from my garden, something I baked for them, a 'gourmet' find from the food outlet, something handmade...something. Most of them do the same. I'd never expect a guest to...+READ
I'm frequently too broke to even take friends out for fast food, but I'll usually bring something for them when I visit (even if I'm not staying overnight, something I generally only do if I drink too much to drive home). Herbs from my garden, something I baked for them, a 'gourmet' find from the food outlet, something handmade...something. Most of them do the same. I'd never expect a guest to take me to dinner (especially since almost everyone I know is unemployed at the moment). A thank you and a plate of brownies is good enough.-COLLAPSE
Isobel_A, although personally I don't like letting favors from others go unpaid (even from my best friends-- I simply don't feel right if they do something nice for me and I don't do something in return), you're totally right-- I would never, EVER expect them to do the same. Spending time with them IS enough-- and frankly, I know they wouldn't expect me to do them a favor for it, either, but I...+READ
Isobel_A, although personally I don't like letting favors from others go unpaid (even from my best friends-- I simply don't feel right if they do something nice for me and I don't do something in return), you're totally right-- I would never, EVER expect them to do the same. Spending time with them IS enough-- and frankly, I know they wouldn't expect me to do them a favor for it, either, but I just like to-- it's it's nice to like to. (The wealthy lawyer thing, though, is fairly egregious-- seriously, if you're in a much more financially stable position than your guest, maybe you should be offering to treat them!) I think the offense I took to this article was the general disrespect both parties seemed to have-- you shouldn't expect your houseguests to treat you, but as a houseguest I feel you should at least *want* to do something for your friend in exchange-- while friendship is not a series of mutual favors, it's just nice to do nice things for people you like. On the flip side, as a houseguest you really ought to be polite enough not to steal un-offered food (at least ask!) or if you do, be willing to replace it if your friend was saving it or something-- but if you're the host, you also need to realize that you're opening your home up to someone and that it's rude to treat them like children and say "you are not allowed to do a b and c while in my home"-- I do, however, think it's okay to say "feel free to eat whatever's in the kitchen except the box of bla bla bla because I'm saving it for when my niece comes over" or something. If your houseguest is your friend, hopefully they'll be nice enough NOT to eat all your food.
Basically, the article turns hosting into a game of tit-for-tat, when what it should really be is mutual respect and kindness-- you shouldn't EXPECT a gift in return for being a host, but certainly if you're a houseguest it's nice to offer-- and not because of some sense of social acceptability, but because you're genuinely thankful and want to show your appreciation.-COLLAPSE
Man this is depressing - whatever happened to friendship? I have never, ever, expected a friend to buy me something just for staying at my house - they are my friends, and spending time with them is enjoyable. As for a lawyer who just made partner expecting to be taken to breakfast by a struggling friend - that would make that person a jerk, frankly. Seriously - what kind of a person sits there...+READ
Man this is depressing - whatever happened to friendship? I have never, ever, expected a friend to buy me something just for staying at my house - they are my friends, and spending time with them is enjoyable. As for a lawyer who just made partner expecting to be taken to breakfast by a struggling friend - that would make that person a jerk, frankly. Seriously - what kind of a person sits there being wealthy and expects struggling friends to buy them things?-COLLAPSE
I'm a Boomer. I would get hives just at the thought of being a house guest to even my BFF. Just way too many bear traps in spending as little time as a weekend in someone else's pad.
Other than that prejudice, I'm impressed with Helena's advice here.
Guests should know better in general. A bad experience with a friend staying as a guest can completely ruin your friendship. I also think it has nothing to do with age. Some people are just dumb when it comes to manners and proper etiquette. And if you're older than 20 and your parents are still doing your laundry and shopping for you...good luck in life.
I think what Helena meant was that ones 20s is when people figure this stuff out. Therefore, it's more forgivable that someone who's a bit younger is also a bit clueless. However, by 30, you should have it down already.
Please don't assume being a twenty-something means you're an inconsiderate jerk. I'm a twenty-something unemployed-recent-grad-school-graduate and basically dirt poor, but if I stayed at a friend's house for any length of time I would certainly take them out for dinner regardless, or at least invited them for a reciprocal dinner at my place some time. I would certainly not eat their cookies...+READ
Please don't assume being a twenty-something means you're an inconsiderate jerk. I'm a twenty-something unemployed-recent-grad-school-graduate and basically dirt poor, but if I stayed at a friend's house for any length of time I would certainly take them out for dinner regardless, or at least invited them for a reciprocal dinner at my place some time. I would certainly not eat their cookies unless they offered them to me, and even then I would be certain to leave plenty. Most of the other people in my peer group who I consider friends would behave the same way.
Your friend's cookie-thieving "friend" just has no manners. It has nothing to do with his age-- if you can't tell the difference between "welcoming friend" and "mom" by the time you're oh... twelve? You need a serious brush up on visiting etiquette. (And seriously, by the time you're in your twenties, you really shouldn't be taking advantage of your real mom like that, either.)-COLLAPSE