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Dear Helena,
I'm a regular at my local farmers' market. Most of the people who come to shop are pretty nice. But some are downright rude. They don't bother to say good morning to the farmers, they manhandle the produce, and, worst of all, they try to bargain. (Interestingly, it's often the richest-looking folks who want to haggle.) Can you set out some basic behavioral guidelines for these people?
—Market Manners
Dear Market Manners,
I talked to some farmers who regularly sell at markets and got their top gripes. Here's what I learned about how they'd like people's manners to improve:
Keep sticker shock to yourself. Whining about the price is less common than it was a few years ago, says Mike Madison, author of Blithe Tomato and owner of Yolo Bulb Farm. This is because people tend to be more educated about the cost of growing organic and the value of local produce. But some customers still harangue stall-holders, says David Winsberg, owner of Happy Quail Farms. "They want to know why the peppers cost so much less at Costco. They really seem to take the price personally."
But complaining is a waste of time, he says: "It's like going to a restaurant. If you don't like the prices on the menu, you don't go in and criticize the chef." In other words, if you think those tomatoes are a ripoff, just take your business elsewhere.
Don't be a buzzard. It might seem reasonable to expect a deal at the end of the day, when farmers may want to offload all their produce before it spoils. But if farmers need to knock down their prices, they will already have done so, Winsberg says. "We call them the buzzards," he explains, referring to customers who swoop in at the end of the day and demand half-price goods. He would rather re-sort the items, reprice them, and sell them at the next market. Or if he's going to donate them, he'll choose "a worthy cause, like Food Runners," not some well-heeled foodie. (Amelia Saltsman, author of The Santa Monica Farmers' Market Cookbook, agrees with the no-haggling rule.)
There is one exception though: when you buy in bulk. Then, say farmers, it's fine to ask for a discount. Just don't expect a protracted bargaining session, Madison says. "It's not like you're in North Africa haggling for three days with a rug seller." Make an offer and a counteroffer, and then either pay the price or move on.
Don't block the aisle. According to Madison, this is "the most consistently annoying thing" about customers' behavior. "Couples walking through the market run into old friends, get talking, run into a few more friends, and soon there's a clump of people completely blocking the farmer's stand." So try to be more aware of your positioning when you stop to gossip.
Don't squeeze and grab everything in sight. Farmers' market produce is more fragile than rock-hard wax-coated apples at your local chain store. While such produce is picked underripe so it can ripen during transport or storage, farmers at the market have often harvested their produce at its prime, so it may be soft and easily bruised. Furthermore, overhandling the merchandise is unsanitary, says Winsberg—and inappropriate in these germ-phobic times. "People pick the produce up and smell it and put it right against their nose. In Europe, you would get your hand slapped right away if you started fondling all the fruit."
Control your kids. Yes, this is an obvious one, but just as some parents let their kids rage out of control in restaurants, they also turn a blind eye as the youngsters mix up signs, knock produce on the ground, or stuff it in their mouths. Winsberg says that kids frequently try to eat the produce at his stall, but since he sells specialty peppers, punishment can be swift. "It can be bad if they grab a really hot one."
Like I was saying before, I think that part of the problem in this discussion is that for folks who are used to shopping at higher priced stores, the prices at certified farmers' markets may not seem that high. The high prices, may seem like a great buy to some people. Few people jet set all over Europe or eat at L'Espalier or Ame. I'm not suggesting for a second there is anything wrong with...+READ
Like I was saying before, I think that part of the problem in this discussion is that for folks who are used to shopping at higher priced stores, the prices at certified farmers' markets may not seem that high. The high prices, may seem like a great buy to some people. Few people jet set all over Europe or eat at L'Espalier or Ame. I'm not suggesting for a second there is anything wrong with doing these things. It sounds perfectly wonderful. But it's possible that people who do are not familiar with prices at stores like Winco.
I went to Yelp. There are 527 reviews of the Ferry Plaza Farmers' Market. I read hundreds of reviews. I did not see one that said the prices were moderate or cheap. A few mentioned that they compared to other expensive stores. There were 14 pages of reviews. Here are just SOME quotes from the top two pages of recent reviews.
"There's nothing really cheap at this Farmer's Market (as can be expected)….
Bottom line: This place gets 5 stars only because of the perfect location. If it weren't for this, the sky-high prices and huge crowds would deter anyone from visiting this farmer's market. This is NOT a place you would go to for weekly grocery shopping trips, unless you're a yuppie."
"The Ferry farmer's market is often overpriced, and breeds a certain food-snob elitism in many San Franciscans that I really don't care for."
"Oh and the prices. $4/lb for some good-looking heirloom tomatoes was a little too much for me."
"This farmers market is amazing, and I do love it. I would love it even more if it didn't drain my wallet as fast as it does."
"This is about my favorite place to be on Saturday mornings in the summer in SF. I know, it's expensive and puts natural food into the boutique category, which I'm not so much in favor of."
"Although this farmers market is one of the expensive ones, I love it"
"This market has it all. Prices are a *biiiiit* high, but not much more than what you'd pay at like... WholeFoods or any other Organic Grocer"
"It's WAY overpriced. I shop at farmer's markets on a weekly basis. I haven't bought produce at a grocery store in over a decade. The produce here costs 2-3 TIMES more than the local markets in SF and everywhere else. It's outrageous and you're not getting more for your money, you're getting taken because this is a tourist trap for people who don't know any better."
"According to Anthony Bourdain, the average Ferry Plaza Farmers Market shopper makes $85,000 a year, and it shows in the astronomical costs"
Prices: Everyone complains about the prices. What do you expect from a place that offers mostly organic/local produce?
I took screen shots of all 14 pages. The comments are really shocking. Not only about the prices but constant complaints about the parking, crowds, long lines, the touristy nature of the market. And it's sad to see the huge numbers of people who think that all the produce is organic. About 2/3 of the produce is not, but so many are assuming that it is.-COLLAPSE
A good etiquette tip is also to bring cash and pay in small bills for small purchases. I think people make fun of the sticker shock reaction because some folks don’t seem to understand what is for sale. Also, when people walk into a grocery store, they plan to spend money. Somehow, that doesn’t seem to automatically translate at the market. Went to the Sunday Farmer's Market in downtown Bethesda...+READ
A good etiquette tip is also to bring cash and pay in small bills for small purchases. I think people make fun of the sticker shock reaction because some folks don’t seem to understand what is for sale. Also, when people walk into a grocery store, they plan to spend money. Somehow, that doesn’t seem to automatically translate at the market. Went to the Sunday Farmer's Market in downtown Bethesda today, spent about what I would on an average trip to the store. Farm fresh organic apples for $2.49 a lb., “yellow peach” organic tomatoes for $3 a pound, I think. Organic, locally produced Raspberry Sage jam for $4. Sourdough boule for $5. Another $20 in misc. produce. All of these purchases were both local and organic, would have cost me the same or more at WF, and the produce probably wouldn’t have been picked in the last 24 hours.
We had a great outdoor shopping experience, we could have made a meal out of all the wonderful samples we ate, and we were able to hand cash directly to farmers and producers. At home I belong to an organic buying club, so I’m very price sensitive. I still see the value, as long as the vendors are friendly with me and my occasionally imperfect child.-COLLAPSE
I can think of 12 different types of outlets for small, local farmers to sell their produce. Some more expensive than others. But when it comes to open air markets, "certified" farmer's markets (CFM) are always expensive - 2, 3 or 4 times more than grocery stores.
Today FoodMax was selling green bell peppers for 39 cents each and red for $1.48lb. Winco had green for 58 cents and red for 68 cents...+READ
I can think of 12 different types of outlets for small, local farmers to sell their produce. Some more expensive than others. But when it comes to open air markets, "certified" farmer's markets (CFM) are always expensive - 2, 3 or 4 times more than grocery stores.
Today FoodMax was selling green bell peppers for 39 cents each and red for $1.48lb. Winco had green for 58 cents and red for 68 cents each. At the CFM in Marin and the Ferry Plaza in SF bell peppers are $5.99lb. That’s 5 and 6 times the cost at grocery stores.
Why does he charge so much for peppers-- because he can. A lot of it has to do with supply and demand. But one reason is there are actually people out there, who, really think they are being savvy shoppers and really think $6 a pound is a great price.
I have been going to all kinds of open air markets for forty years. I've been on both sides of the table (never a food vendor). I’ve seen the prices of produce at all different kinds of places. There were a group of us; we'd meet at the CFM weekly. While walking around looking at the great produce, we'd sample boulani and amazing olive oil. Lunch was usually a skewer of Filipino bbq'ed chicken thighs. Then we'd walk up to FoodMax to get the produce we needed. We compared prices this way all summer long.
In this story/thread few people are denying that prices are high at the farmer's markets. The vendors aren’t, they admit to it. But this is a story about manners not high prices. If we want to debate prices, we can, but it might work out better on another thread.
So.... is it polite to stand around and ridicule your customers - calling them names because they can't afford outrageous prices. One person has suggested that it’s ok to do so - just "human nature". Hmm... so referring to someone as white trash just because they can't afford $6.00lb for bell peppers is just human nature and completely acceptable? Is it ok to say it to their face, or is it better to wait till they leave and do it behind their back? Let's say... the person who didn't want to do something as ridiculous as pay $6 for peppers was not Caucasian. Let's say she was Asian, Hispanic or African American. The vendor couldn't say "white trash". That would make no kinda sense at all. So, what slur would be acceptable? Again…. Remember…. this is an article about manners.
At least the person who made this post (the "human nature one") is not hypocritically hiding behind the fact that Farmer's Markets are supposed to be a community - something that is building the sustainable food MOVEMENT. She admits to being new to Chow but a big fan of the profit end of the produce business. The same ol' if you don't like the prices - get out of my face thing.
But to some of us, this is important. Some of us strongly believe that our food is our medicine. We need decent fruit and vegetables to stay healthy. This is not trend "de jour" or luxury items. This IS a movement; we ARE trying to build community. If the vendor's aren't listening... really hearing what consumers are saying... if we turn over complete control of this "movement/community" then there is no movement.. No community. All there is a marketing gimmick to jack up prices. For really great, organic, fresh picked, local produce - supply is low and demand is high. Sometimes that doesn’t work out too well for the consumer. But, YES we should have faith in the organic farmers that are working hard, who are friendly and who are trying to keep prices fair. Yeah.. we should have faith. But maybe just a little bit less blind faith: because once in a while supply-and-demand-induced greed might be hard to resist. This is a movement and a partnership among all concerned - not just another marketing option. Our voices need to be heard.
A question was posed: Do you haggle at the grocery store? As a matter of fact, I have - numerous times - as has countless others - for years. This was asked in an attempt to make the point "no one haggles at grocery stores: so why should ya haggle at farmer's markets". People have been haggling over prices for several hundred years. But, just recently, ever since "certified" markets have been the trend have there been a small number of vendors trying to get us to believe that it’s rude or inappropriate. The tactics they’re using are appalling: name calling/brow beating/intimidation. There are insults hurled at consumers in this story that haven't even been pointed out by anyone posting on the thread. And the trickery contained in the idea, well, you don't haggle at restaurants so why do so at a CFM? People don't negotiate at restaurants – but they do at farmer's markets. The two don't have anything to do with each other. This is an advertising ploy: Trying to make a point by comparing two things that are unrelated. If I'm in a restaurant and order a salad, three or four farmers don't come out with bags of whole vegetables, weigh 'em and charge me so much per pound. Likewise, if I'm at a CFM and buy some lettuce, tomatoes and cukes, I don't expect the farmer to slice it all up and compose a salad for me. The real question is why are a small handful of contemporary vendors trying to change a process that has succeeded for centuries. And then try to make us feel guilty for doing something that is perfectly natural to do.
As far as "backlash" goes, despite some differing opinions, this thread has been pretty civilized. Maybe you haven't followed a lot of threads on the internet. Check out the story in this series on politically incorrect takeout. At first, I didn't know Chow had a "manners" column. But this headline caught my eye. Since then I have become a follower, even a fan of the column. There have been three stories in this series since this one was posted. I think her advice in those last three has been spot on. For one reason, they have been balanced. In the most recent - about yelling out "Hey amigo" while trying to get the attention of the wait staff in a Mexican food restaurant. Her advice: “maybe yes, maybe no, depending on your tone and other factors. But you might want to play it safe and chose other wording”. Seems perfect to me. Another reason I like these last three columns, is in these no one advocated rudeness as a means to deal with the issue. This is a story about manners; geez... how is being rude going to resolve anything?-COLLAPSE
Wow. I am not one to usually comment on these sorts of things, in fact I am quite new to chowhound. However I feel as though something has to be said about the other side.
First off, I understand the principle that Farmer's Markets tend to be over-priced. In Boston, it was more of a yuppie thing to do to go to the FM and therefore the prices seemed to reflect that. However, I also do think...+READ
Wow. I am not one to usually comment on these sorts of things, in fact I am quite new to chowhound. However I feel as though something has to be said about the other side.
First off, I understand the principle that Farmer's Markets tend to be over-priced. In Boston, it was more of a yuppie thing to do to go to the FM and therefore the prices seemed to reflect that. However, I also do think that it has to do with the fact that New England has extremely variable seasons and available farmland and therefore year to year the crop and yield may be quite different. However the cost that goes into producing such produce generally just goes up.
When I was in SF a year and a half ago we went to the FM at the Ferry. It was AMAZING! I am quite a thrifty shopper, can tell you what the going price is for most anything, and I definitely found that FM to be quite competitive. And the produce was to die for. My husband had to remind me that we were just visiting and not stocking the fridge.
We recently moved to Nashville and now spend every Sat morning at the FM. I have found each of the farmers to be quite friendly and many of them now recognize me. I have my booth that I just like the farmers, the booth that has the best tomatoes, etc. We also get our milk there every week in glass jars. This FM is CHEAPER than the groc store. Now go out to the Franklin one and the same farmers are charging sometimes 1.5 - 2x as much for the same produce. Why? Because that is what the market will take. We have been amazed by the bounty here in Nashville and will be quite sad when the season ends.
But it is a business. So the farmers can certainy say for you to shop elsewhere if you don't like the prices. Do you haggle at the grocery store? With whom? Can you ever even find someone to ask if there are more tomatoes out back for you to look at if you don't like what you see?
And in every story there are two sides. I am sure that most people who wait on you have some sort of a nickname or comment about your behavior. That is human nature. I can't imagine that this writer thought that there was going to be such a backlash from the article. I was not offended at all and it wasn't until I read the comments that I was so surprised at how everyone else had responded.-COLLAPSE
I love the market but can only afford the coffee at 1.50, then we buy a cookie and walk around. I just can't justify the price point, my husband is a chef, we are well aware of food costs, but inflated prices are hard to justify. Keep it real. The prices are for the cool upper-crusts and others who make their way down to the market, but not for most or "average" people. Common folk don't go near,...+READ
I love the market but can only afford the coffee at 1.50, then we buy a cookie and walk around. I just can't justify the price point, my husband is a chef, we are well aware of food costs, but inflated prices are hard to justify. Keep it real. The prices are for the cool upper-crusts and others who make their way down to the market, but not for most or "average" people. Common folk don't go near, or don't return to the market because they can't afford it. Plain and simple.-COLLAPSE
I've worked in business a very long time; I know how it works in terms of making a dollar...while I can appreciate the extra effort it takes to farm organic produce, it don't make no kind of sense to rob people with four times the cost at a farmer's market just because it's a "farmer's market".
Personally, I don't buy into the hype. If there's a choice between cheaper, fresher & ripe produce...+READ
I've worked in business a very long time; I know how it works in terms of making a dollar...while I can appreciate the extra effort it takes to farm organic produce, it don't make no kind of sense to rob people with four times the cost at a farmer's market just because it's a "farmer's market".
Personally, I don't buy into the hype. If there's a choice between cheaper, fresher & ripe produce at a supermarket vs. farmer's market, the one with the lowest price is going to get my money. If the farmer's market wants my money, they'll lower the prices. I'll never pay $5.00 for a basket of berries, ever.-COLLAPSE
"Stop to gossip"? What an attitude. And you want to punish children for eating a veggie by letting her eat a hot pepper? How welcoming. I am glad our farmers' market is much friendlier -- and encourages the sampling of the produce. A good way to get kids to become healthier eaters. We love our local farmers and support all year. Glad they are nothing like you.
To Richshewmaker:
I peel the husk down an inch or so, because that is where worms and rot are most likely to reside. It does indeed give me information that is not otherwise visible. I learned this from growing up in a farming community. If you find a worm, or a bunch of chewed up kernels, it's ok to quietly tell the vendor, since it is not their goal to sell damaged produce.
After reading this, I'll never shop in a farmers' market again.
Originally, this was an article about manners (being polite). These two vendors and two writers were, imo, so rude it was like a virtual slap in the face. Calling their customers’ names: Really..... buzzard?? I was so shocked when I read that, I went to urbandictionary.com just to make sure that I wasn't confused. Calling someone buzzard is akin to calling them white trash. Even if this vendor...+READ
Originally, this was an article about manners (being polite). These two vendors and two writers were, imo, so rude it was like a virtual slap in the face. Calling their customers’ names: Really..... buzzard?? I was so shocked when I read that, I went to urbandictionary.com just to make sure that I wasn't confused. Calling someone buzzard is akin to calling them white trash. Even if this vendor didn't mean it that harshly, it still shows that he has not exactly wrapped his head around the idea that a certified farmer's market "is a community". This is just one of the insults in the story. It's sad to think that there are vendors out there standing around with their sons ridiculing their customers. How is the mannerly? Remember, this is the guy that is selling bell peppers for $6.00 to $25.00 a pound.
Part of the problem is that this story is poorly written. 1. It is biased. So much so, it feels almost like industry propaganda. Maybe that was not the writer's intentions. Can't tell for sure. 2. The two vendors are angry and bitter. How did she pick these two to feature? When she quotes the vendors, you can almost see them roll their eyes and mock their customers. 3. The writer spends a lot of time echoing the attitude of the vendors. It's bad enough that vendors are saying, "well, if you don't like the prices-get out of my face". Now, we have writers trying to make us feel guilty because we can't afford inflated prices. 4. Parts of the article are nonsense. I realize that trying to be shocking and controversial is all the rage today. It's all about building readership. But has fact-checking gone completely out of style? 5. The whole "fake letter" thing at the beginning. This has been done before. I betcha that at first this was a novel and interesting way to begin an article. It can still be interesting when done well - not just used as a crutch.
I guess name calling, eye rolling, and a general "get out of my face attitude" are not the biggest problems in the world. But they don't build "community". I don't like it when vendors "use" the fact that farmer's markets are supposed to be a community to do nothing more than aggressively market their products. The idea that I should be willing to spend $3 a pound for squash instead of 79 cents because at the farmer's market, I'll get advice how to cook it... absurd. I know how to cook squash. But, if I haven't had a lot of luck with squash in the past, I know how to find out. There are many ways of finding out without spending any money at all. Why do some vendors think that they should charge for advice?
Of course the main idea used to guilt us into not trying to haggle is that the produce at certified farmer's market is so much higher quality. It's organic, it tastes better, lasts longer, keeps the local economy going, etc. I could not possible agree more. These are fantastic reasons not to buy produce at Winco. But, all these reasons are completely irrelevant if you can't afford the sky-high prices. It's useless to say well, awful tomatoes at the store are $3.00 and my wonderful ones are $4.00 so buy mine. This reasoning means nothing to the vast majority of people who can't even afford to buy the "cheaper" awful tomatoes.
If vendors were really interested in building "community", then they would spend a lot more time actually listening with an open mind and open heart to their customers. Even a lot of large corporations are at least experimenting with that idea. Trying to make people believe that you have "the community's best interest in mind" when you offer some "cheaper" alternative if the consumer buys a bulk/large amount seems like just another marketing ploy. The vendor may have good intentions. But, each week, people have a long list of items they need to buy. Folks on a budget can only spend so much on each item. It does no good to know that I can buy those wonderful tomatoes at a reasonable price so long as I buy more than I can afford and more than I can use. If the vendor offering this pricing structure was interested in "community" they wouldn't criticize the consumer for "getting mad". Duh... it's a maddening situation. And then copping that whole "too bad, get out of my face" attitude. That is not polite (the point of this story) and it doesn't build community. This sort of bad attitude only makes matters worse.-COLLAPSE
I have a pet peeve that applies in supermarkets as well as farmers' markets. Why do some people feel they have the right to peel back the husks on sweet corn to examine them, then replace them into the stock? This actually provides them with no useful information; it just reduces the freshness of the corn and gives other customers doubts about the produce. (If it's not good enough for her, why...+READ
I have a pet peeve that applies in supermarkets as well as farmers' markets. Why do some people feel they have the right to peel back the husks on sweet corn to examine them, then replace them into the stock? This actually provides them with no useful information; it just reduces the freshness of the corn and gives other customers doubts about the produce. (If it's not good enough for her, why would I want to buy it?) All you need to examine on an ear of corn to determine that it is ready to eat is the silk and the husk. Once the silk, which starts browning at the tips, has browned all the way down to the ear, but the husk is still bright green and moist, the corn is at its prime and ready to eat. If the silk is only brown halfway down, the ear will not be full at the tip end. If the husk is dry and starting to turn yellow at the tip end, the corn is past its prime, and has probably lost some of its sweetness as the sugars convert to starch. All this you can see at a glance, without ripping open the ears and ravaging the seller's display.
--richshewmaker-COLLAPSE
Actually, in Italy, the hypermarkets like Iper Coop etc. make one use a disposable glove to handle the produce; Nowhere, in the open markets have I seen anyone fondling the produce; and you would get a stern "NO TOCARE" if you did.
I've seen produce (lemons) squeezed and thoroughly inspected by a group of elderly ladies in Italy. No hands were slapped. They are not quite the germaphobes we are and it seemed quite acceptable. My issue was with the suggestion that in Europe, people do not handle produce, or if they do, it's done with much more panache. Rubbish. What is rude in one country remains rude in another. I've seen it...+READ
I've seen produce (lemons) squeezed and thoroughly inspected by a group of elderly ladies in Italy. No hands were slapped. They are not quite the germaphobes we are and it seemed quite acceptable. My issue was with the suggestion that in Europe, people do not handle produce, or if they do, it's done with much more panache. Rubbish. What is rude in one country remains rude in another. I've seen it on both continents.-COLLAPSE
I'm not a farmer, but I sell at a farmer's booth at one of our local markets. I agree that some of this advice is pretty basic courtesy - but like in other areas of life, you'd be surprised how many people don't follow it. A few stream-of-consciousness points:
A successful farmer's market is a community. In terms of interacting with customers, I find working at the stand to be more akin to...+READ
I'm not a farmer, but I sell at a farmer's booth at one of our local markets. I agree that some of this advice is pretty basic courtesy - but like in other areas of life, you'd be surprised how many people don't follow it. A few stream-of-consciousness points:
A successful farmer's market is a community. In terms of interacting with customers, I find working at the stand to be more akin to waiting tables than working a retail job. I know my regular customers' families and cooking habits, I spend a lot of time giving advice on how to best braise a beef shank or cook crowder peas. This is a far cry from having the checkout person at a chain grocery ask you what a zucchini is so they know what PLU# to enter.
Yeah - a lot of things cost more at a farmer's market. But a lot of things are also pretty competitive. This summer, we sold amazing heirloom tomatoes for $4/pound. I see tasteless grocery store tomatoes for almost $3/pound. When our $4/pound tomatoes are produced locally, are certified organic, taste amazing, are higher in nutrients, last longer on your counter and keep your money in your community, I think shoppers are getting a hell of a deal! So, when we ran a bulk special that worked out to $2/pound and a woman got mad and walked away because I wouldn't give her a much smaller amount for $2/pound, I didn't sweat it. I know we provide value and great products, and we sold out of tomatoes.
Another thing - a lot of us don't have the time or inclination to deal with any change smaller than a quarter. And, we want you to feel like you got value. A lot of times, I round down to the nearest dollar (or .50), or I'll throw in a little something extra (an onion, one more squash, a head of garlic, one more handful of okra, whatever works) if you round up to the dollar, and this usually makes you get a deal. Especially if I like you.
The farm I work for is by all counts, successful, but they don't make much money. Nobody I know is getting rich farming - chances are, they're barely breaking even. $10 can go a mile or a few feet at a farmer's market - it's all how you choose to spend it. But being a good customer and developing relationships with the vendors will work in your favor. Frankly, there are weeks I do 75% of my produce shopping at an organic market, and weeks I can't afford to go. Do what's best for you and your budget, but with careful planning, you can find a balance.
And, strawberry-squeezing lady, popsicle-dripping-on-the-veggies lady, person whose dog always pees when you're not looking - we've got our eyes on you!-COLLAPSE
"At Chicago farmers' markets a pint of berries costs $5 and the same pint is on sale at local chain markets for 99 cents."
Is it really the same pint of berries, though? (And if so, why bother at the farmers' mkt.?) I live in a major strawberry-growing region in CA, and the berries even at the best produce markets are often not as good as what's at the local (CA Certified) farmers' markets. The...+READ
"At Chicago farmers' markets a pint of berries costs $5 and the same pint is on sale at local chain markets for 99 cents."
Is it really the same pint of berries, though? (And if so, why bother at the farmers' mkt.?) I live in a major strawberry-growing region in CA, and the berries even at the best produce markets are often not as good as what's at the local (CA Certified) farmers' markets. The ones on sale at chain supermarkets are nowhere near what I can get at produce markets, let alone farmers' mkts. Now, I agree we should be able to make sure the produce is good, ripe, etc., but what was addressed here was OVERhandling, not reasonable examination. That's pretty clear, I think.-COLLAPSE
"Because there *can* be such a vast and marked difference between rude and respectful, for starters?"
Thanks for clearing that up.
@cafesimile "Why do people act as if European behavior and choices are the yardstick by which everything should be judged? "
Because there *can* be such a vast and marked difference between rude and respectful, for starters?
"In Europe, you would get your hand slapped right away if you started fondling all the fruit." Why do people act as if European behavior and choices are the yardstick by which everything should be judged?
i think table manners should write a similar article for farmers market sellers ,ie tho shalt not buy from the superstore down the road then sell it at the market at a 100 percent markup(ya you know who you are ,for shame ,for shame).and everbody says "support your local farmers market"ha what a farce.
I get the feeling that this article is a lot like Mythbusters. They're pretty much making stuff up to test them out and some of the absurd letters I've seen on here lead to the same reasoning.
I don't see how it's rude to check out/touch the produce before buying -- in fact, you can do that at the grocery store, too. Just don't damage anything or (duh) taste it, unless someone's offering a sample.
OMG! I'm going broke at the farmer's market! I LOVE the farmer's market, it's fairy land to me, but GEEZ...they're killing me and I tend to be fairly elastic w/ food costs. $5 canteloupe? $5 tiny bag of potatoes? $4 tomato? $6 for a head of cauliflower not much bigger than my fist? $20 quart of honey? I'm having to start asking "how much" before I buy, and still sometimes I'm shocked when I...+READ
OMG! I'm going broke at the farmer's market! I LOVE the farmer's market, it's fairy land to me, but GEEZ...they're killing me and I tend to be fairly elastic w/ food costs. $5 canteloupe? $5 tiny bag of potatoes? $4 tomato? $6 for a head of cauliflower not much bigger than my fist? $20 quart of honey? I'm having to start asking "how much" before I buy, and still sometimes I'm shocked when I didn't realize how heavy something was.
And the prepared items? I bought a $4 rice cake w/ peanut butter on it the other day. Too embarrassed to tell her I didn't want it after all. This is the rural Carolinas...not Union Square. We aren't used to this.
I'm starting to feel abused.-COLLAPSE
opehlia payne: yes, as you and a few others point out, it may depend on where the farmer's market is. I'm sure in swank areas of northern CA where real estate is still extraordinary, small-business produce is all the more costly. Here in CO, it depends on the item, but overall the prices seem on a par with those of grocery stores.
I think that if a parent let his/her child run wild and the child puts a really hot pepper in his mouth, I would consider the price of the lost pepper worth the entertainment I would get from watching the kid react. I would also love to watch the parent's reaction. Maybe it would be a learning experience.
I also agree with most of the other posters that inspecting the produce before buying is not only not rude, but necessary. I don't stand there with a magnifying glass looking for tiny blemishes, but it would be silly not to be at all concerned with quality.
Haggling would seem more tacky to me than outright rude, but on the other hand, we're fortunate enough that sellers at our local farmer's...+READ
I also agree with most of the other posters that inspecting the produce before buying is not only not rude, but necessary. I don't stand there with a magnifying glass looking for tiny blemishes, but it would be silly not to be at all concerned with quality.
Haggling would seem more tacky to me than outright rude, but on the other hand, we're fortunate enough that sellers at our local farmer's market (Chicago, in a city park a few blocks from our home) are quite inexpensive, at least for the produce. We typically get 2-3 tote bags of fruit and veggies for $30-$40. That same two bags of produce would cost us three times that at the grocery store.-COLLAPSE
I don't enjoy haggling. If the price is not what I like, I'll move on. I find this pretty unlikely though. Aside from the fact that I'm always willing to pay for good food, I tend to believe that most farmers at the market are pricing competively. I can't imagine any of them are getting rich off the markets, I know how hard the work is, and I value it so deeply! In a recession, I'll omit the...+READ
I don't enjoy haggling. If the price is not what I like, I'll move on. I find this pretty unlikely though. Aside from the fact that I'm always willing to pay for good food, I tend to believe that most farmers at the market are pricing competively. I can't imagine any of them are getting rich off the markets, I know how hard the work is, and I value it so deeply! In a recession, I'll omit the luxuries, and not skimp on the necessities!
With regards to sniffing, I'm entirely guilty and I don't think I can stop. I just can't buy a tomato that doesn't smell like anything at all, or a peach that is hard as a rock. I will be extra mindful when picking them up and putting them back down though. And hope all farmers will understand.
Thanks for the tip about not blocking! I'm pretty sure I don't do that since I rarely see people I know at the market, but when chatting with the farmers, I'll try to be more mindful about not blocking the table!-COLLAPSE
I think there's a distinct difference between "whining about prices" and haggling. I know it may still be a bit rude, especially in American culture, but haggling at a market doesn't strike me as completely offensive. Maybe a farmer's market isn't the place for it?
In Montreal, produce is much cheaper at the farmers markets than in the grocery store. Going to the farmers markets is very commonplace here, and shopping at the farmers market isn't just for foodies, as in many American markets (that is, from what I've seen along the East Coast). I think it helps that the markets are open 7 days/week and the general laidback attitude of Canada, but also because...+READ
In Montreal, produce is much cheaper at the farmers markets than in the grocery store. Going to the farmers markets is very commonplace here, and shopping at the farmers market isn't just for foodies, as in many American markets (that is, from what I've seen along the East Coast). I think it helps that the markets are open 7 days/week and the general laidback attitude of Canada, but also because it's less expensive than the supermarkets, it doesn't have the same socioeconomic status as in the US.-COLLAPSE
this article is stupid. these are common courtesies applicable in any environment and it's not that people don't know of them. people who don't do these things know, they just don't care. don't be so self-righteous, gypsy-farmers!
These are basic manners that people should apply all of the time. I find it frustrating that some people want to touch everything all of the time.
Is haggling (or declining to haggle) rude? No, of course not. Unless you do it in a rude way. Just like making a phone call or sending an email. Neither is rude, unless you say rude things. Two people can haggle without being rude and vendors can decline politely. It’s absurd to think otherwise.
Prices at certified farmer’s markets are, virtually without exception 2, 3 or 4 times the prices at...+READ
Is haggling (or declining to haggle) rude? No, of course not. Unless you do it in a rude way. Just like making a phone call or sending an email. Neither is rude, unless you say rude things. Two people can haggle without being rude and vendors can decline politely. It’s absurd to think otherwise.
Prices at certified farmer’s markets are, virtually without exception 2, 3 or 4 times the prices at most grocery stores. If you read this story carefully you’ll see that the only four people given a voice (it’s a one-sided piece) FULLY ADMIT that prices are high at farmer’s markets. They don’t deny it. They use the article to try and guilt or brow beat us into not grumbling about these high prices or not have the nerve to dicker.
Winsberg said that “shopping at a farmer’s market is like going to a restaurant. If the prices are too high at the restaurant, don’t criticize the chef. Just go dine somewhere else.” Funny thing tho, shopping at a farmer’s market is NOT AT ALL like going to a restaurant. For centuries, folks have been haggling over prices at farmer’s markets. You can’t say that about restaurants. This is an advertising gimmick: trying to make a sales point by comparing two things that are unrelated.
There are high-end grocery stores, like Whole Foods, some food co-ops, specialty markets that have much higher prices then stores like Winco, Wallmart and several others. For folks who can afford to shop at Whole Foods, the prices at certified farmer’s markets may not seem that high. But the vast majority of consumers can’t afford to buy all their produce at high-end outlets. Even tho, it’s probable that the produce is a much better quality. It is just not possible. The people in this story seem to be saying “we prefer to deal with the privileged and if you’re not so lucky, well then you’re just shit outta luck.” Apparently, not only do they not want any insolence, they don’t even want our feedback.
If farmer’s can’t figure out how to bring produce to market that people can actually afford, then people are gonna grumble. This has been true for centuries. The vendors in this story have a bad attitude. For the sustainable food movement to succeed, we need to build relationships between farmer, wholesaler, retailer, AND consumer.-COLLAPSE
As relates to mrgreenbeenz's comment about the "Church of the Organic Farmers Maket", I'd say you have a point on some level. Some of those people (at least, some of the ones who frequent the farmers markets around me) seem to follow an version of this which I call "The Canon of the Holy Homesteader" where the excessive prices you pay are not so much because you are glad the farmer is providing...+READ
As relates to mrgreenbeenz's comment about the "Church of the Organic Farmers Maket", I'd say you have a point on some level. Some of those people (at least, some of the ones who frequent the farmers markets around me) seem to follow an version of this which I call "The Canon of the Holy Homesteader" where the excessive prices you pay are not so much because you are glad the farmer is providing it, but because you are guilty of having to buy produce at all, rather than living somewhere where you can grow all of your own food as all people should (remember this is thier tenets not mine) Excessive prices are basically somwhere between a penance and a pardon/indulgence.
On the matter of chatting, I agree that blocing the way and or stalls is not appropritate, but I'd say that some degree of interaction between people is integral to the farmers market experiance. After all socialization is one of the main reasons why farmers markets/village markets/market days etc. were invented in the first place. If the only interaction allowed between people at a farmers market is the bare minimum needed to make the actual purchases they they might as well simply replace the markets with stores.
On that subject I have one more tiny ettique suggestion. It is perfectly accetabe to converse with sellers IF THEY WISH, whether or not you are actually buying anything from them at the moment (indeed if they want to converse this is great farmers markets shoud also be there for the exchange of ideas as well as produce) However don't block people who are actually buying and if someone show up who wishes to actually make a purchase, SHUT UP. The farmer is there to sell his wares first and foremost, don't impeded that.-COLLAPSE
Querencia: again, the story doesn't say you can't chat with your neighbors. It says don't block the stall entrances with your chat. Surely you're not implying that the amount you spend gives you the right to be rude.
Look. At Chicago farmers' markets a pint of berries costs $5 and the same pint is on sale at local chain markets for 99 cents. So if we're willing to pay their prices, the vendors should be willing to put up with our chatting with neighbors and bringing our dogs on leashes. Buying at these markets, at least in Chicago, is a luxury---it's not unusual to drop $50 in an in an hour at our farmers'...+READ
Look. At Chicago farmers' markets a pint of berries costs $5 and the same pint is on sale at local chain markets for 99 cents. So if we're willing to pay their prices, the vendors should be willing to put up with our chatting with neighbors and bringing our dogs on leashes. Buying at these markets, at least in Chicago, is a luxury---it's not unusual to drop $50 in an in an hour at our farmers' markets, and double that if you're buying a lot of flowers for a party. You're dead right that we want to know whether that box of tomatoes is nice underneath before we buy it. If the vendors don't want our trade, we can arrange that.-COLLAPSE
Tatamagouche - agreed, if you're buying a lot of something, or a lot on a stall, I'd definitely expect a kind of 'well, I'll do you all of this for £10 instead of £11' offer, but if I didn't get one I'd perhaps suggest it. I'm used to French markets and terrible at haggling, but it's never an issue there because stallholders generally shout out offers at me! If they're having a slow day or just...+READ
Tatamagouche - agreed, if you're buying a lot of something, or a lot on a stall, I'd definitely expect a kind of 'well, I'll do you all of this for £10 instead of £11' offer, but if I didn't get one I'd perhaps suggest it. I'm used to French markets and terrible at haggling, but it's never an issue there because stallholders generally shout out offers at me! If they're having a slow day or just like what you're wearing then you can get some good deals, all the more so if you smile sweetly while doing it. And if they're making good offers it you can pick and chose the best of the bunch, without even having to initiate haggling yourself.
And yes - the whole 'no handling of fruit in Europe' thing? Totally untrue. I remember getting told by a stallholder that I wasn't handling the fruit the *right way* to check its ripeness, i.e. pressing the wrong bit or end or something of one particular kind of fruit, but people pick over things with their hands all the time, at least in France.-COLLAPSE
What's with all the posters who say peeling back the husks on corn is a sin???
At my farmer's market in Virginia, the farmers actually put out large bins where the shoppers can throw the husks before they buy (I assume they collect these for some other sort of purpose, unless it's just to keep the husks from blowing all over the market). Obviously this is a practice the farmers encourage! I...+READ
What's with all the posters who say peeling back the husks on corn is a sin???
At my farmer's market in Virginia, the farmers actually put out large bins where the shoppers can throw the husks before they buy (I assume they collect these for some other sort of purpose, unless it's just to keep the husks from blowing all over the market). Obviously this is a practice the farmers encourage! I think they, as most of us, understand no one wants to buy a fruit or vegetable completely sight-unseen. And, yes, there have been times when I pull back the husks to find the top half of the cob looks brownish or eaten or something, so it's not like just because an ear of corn is located in a farmers market we can assume it won't ever be bad!-COLLAPSE
"A lot of the advice about kids and blocking stalls and handling fruit falls under common sense etiquette."
True that, erwocky—true about 90% of Helena's columns. Still I love to get all worked up. :)
A. Nonnie -- The corn thing, for me, has absolutely nothing to do with finding pests. Not a thing. But if someone's going to say their corn is "freshly picked this morning", I'm going to be royally (and rightfully) pissed off if I get home and shuck the stuff to find it was probably "freshly picked" four days ago! I'm a country girl and I know my sweet corn, so I won't pull a whole side of the...+READ
A. Nonnie -- The corn thing, for me, has absolutely nothing to do with finding pests. Not a thing. But if someone's going to say their corn is "freshly picked this morning", I'm going to be royally (and rightfully) pissed off if I get home and shuck the stuff to find it was probably "freshly picked" four days ago! I'm a country girl and I know my sweet corn, so I won't pull a whole side of the husks off, but I'll open the ear far enough to check if the corn's still milky and sweet, or if it might as well be chopped up for animal feed. I'm just plain not going to buy produce if it's crap, and there's no other way to check sweet corn than to open it up a little. A vendor who forbids his customers from checking his product has something to hide, IMO.-COLLAPSE
I find competition among sellers keeps the prices reasonable at our market. So does the plethora of folks willing to grow their own. Our market sellers want people to linger at their stands. They encourage people to sample and ask about the food. Sometimes I go to browse and end up buying because I tried something and it was just terrific (I am particularly susceptible to berries and sugar peas)....+READ
I find competition among sellers keeps the prices reasonable at our market. So does the plethora of folks willing to grow their own. Our market sellers want people to linger at their stands. They encourage people to sample and ask about the food. Sometimes I go to browse and end up buying because I tried something and it was just terrific (I am particularly susceptible to berries and sugar peas).
As far as dogs and children go. They should be well behaved regardless. If they aren't, well that is life. Don't sweat the small stuff as they say.
About negotiating - I find if you call ahead of time and tell them you are going to want to buy a really big amount of something you can negotiate a discount then rather than do it in front of other customers who will want the same deal. I do this from time to time and it works well for both of us. They can bring say - my brussel sprouts ready to go still on the hoof and have the price marked for me) and have plenty more for the rest of the customers and I can have a slight discount and food ready to go.-COLLAPSE
How about control/don't bring your dog? Even though our market has several signs, I saw a woman blithely walking around with a dog on a leash, and the dog was mouthing some strawberries! At one point, the dog started to jump on me ( I walked fairly close in an attempt to make a scene....) , and the woman looks at me as if to say "isn't that sweet?".
The thing is, the people who are most in need of this advice are unlikely to read it. Somehow I doubt they think of themselves as faux pas-prone enough to identify with the title here . . .
My biggest farmers' market annoyance, and maybe it's a NYC-specific one, is people who meander through, slow as molasses, apparently with no intention of buying anything, either because they're non-cooks or...+READ
The thing is, the people who are most in need of this advice are unlikely to read it. Somehow I doubt they think of themselves as faux pas-prone enough to identify with the title here . . .
My biggest farmers' market annoyance, and maybe it's a NYC-specific one, is people who meander through, slow as molasses, apparently with no intention of buying anything, either because they're non-cooks or tourists with no kitchen to cook in. I wouldn't mind at all if they were mindful that people around them are actually trying to do their shopping, but they don't seem to be.
2nd biggest annoyance: Unpeelers of corn. There is no reason to ruin it that way. If you're that afraid of finding a pest in your food, stick to canned veg, and if you're that afraid of one of your 6 or 7 ears of corn being less than physically perfect, buy an extra one or two.-COLLAPSE
Sorry , why shouldn't kids, any less than adults, understand proper behavoir for any circumstance they find themselves in? Just because a produce market is outside, kids can "be kids" and adultts can cause socialializing traffic jams? Youngsters should be taught to respect and interact with others no matter where they are. These are skills they will need their entire lifetime.
I do see more...+READ
Sorry , why shouldn't kids, any less than adults, understand proper behavoir for any circumstance they find themselves in? Just because a produce market is outside, kids can "be kids" and adultts can cause socialializing traffic jams? Youngsters should be taught to respect and interact with others no matter where they are. These are skills they will need their entire lifetime.
I do see more well-behaved adults and kids at Farmer's Markets than not, and it warms the cockles of my heart. The young ones get on well with people, and are fun to be around because their parents constantly show them, with their own behavior, how to.-COLLAPSE
You're right, tatamagouche and amyk, and I will stop being snarky to agree with you. Handling the produce gently, sniffing it without wiping your nose on it, and generally respecting the produce are the right thing to do. But I would tend not to buy from anyone who wouldn't let me at least do those things (e.g. many vendors at Haymarket here in Boston, which isn't a farmers market anyway).
And...+READ
You're right, tatamagouche and amyk, and I will stop being snarky to agree with you. Handling the produce gently, sniffing it without wiping your nose on it, and generally respecting the produce are the right thing to do. But I would tend not to buy from anyone who wouldn't let me at least do those things (e.g. many vendors at Haymarket here in Boston, which isn't a farmers market anyway).
And as babingta points out, there are different styles of famers market and different types of people who frequent them, from the well-heeled to the not-so. Farmers probably differ on things like haggling, but a lot of the advice about kids and blocking stalls and handling fruit falls under common sense etiquette.-COLLAPSE
I came from Florida where the farmer's markets were often MUCH cheaper than the grocery store. Now that I've moved north, I find that farmer's markets are often more "boutique" and pricier than the store. That was a disappointment for me given my familiarity with the 356-days-a-year farmer's markets in the Sunshine State, but, I agree with the article: If I am not up for those prices, I just...+READ
I came from Florida where the farmer's markets were often MUCH cheaper than the grocery store. Now that I've moved north, I find that farmer's markets are often more "boutique" and pricier than the store. That was a disappointment for me given my familiarity with the 356-days-a-year farmer's markets in the Sunshine State, but, I agree with the article: If I am not up for those prices, I just don't go.
Incidentally, I wonder if that is part of the difference some people are noting? Perhaps farmer's markets are cheaper in the places that the farmers don't have as far to go and can sell their produce outdoors any day of the year?-COLLAPSE
How is it petty to expect respectful treatment? What seems petty to me is bitching about not being allowed to smell or touch the fruit or talk to your friends, when that's not even what the article says. It says don't OVERhandle the fruit. It says don't BLOCK the stall entrance. It doesn't say kids should be "perfect," it just says they shouldn't be monsters. The fact that all that seems to be...+READ
How is it petty to expect respectful treatment? What seems petty to me is bitching about not being allowed to smell or touch the fruit or talk to your friends, when that's not even what the article says. It says don't OVERhandle the fruit. It says don't BLOCK the stall entrance. It doesn't say kids should be "perfect," it just says they shouldn't be monsters. The fact that all that seems to be too much to ask is a bit shocking.
As for the haggling, though, I agree with most commenters: it seems perfectly within the bounds of etiquette to me to politely engage with a seller on price. He or she can refuse if uninterested.-COLLAPSE
Seems like many commenters have lost sight of the fact that these farmers work very hard to grow and harvest their produce. In the case of corn, the farmer you see behind the table may very well have been up at 4am picking it. I always grant them as much respect as I can. It's not a glamorous profession and these people are not millionaires. Just remember that the next time you man-handle...+READ
Seems like many commenters have lost sight of the fact that these farmers work very hard to grow and harvest their produce. In the case of corn, the farmer you see behind the table may very well have been up at 4am picking it. I always grant them as much respect as I can. It's not a glamorous profession and these people are not millionaires. Just remember that the next time you man-handle someone's tomatoes or peel the husk back on 15 ears of corn and throw them back. I don't care if you ARE buying a dozen ears. It doesn't give you the right to ruin 10 and leave them behind. Ok, sorry. That one is my pet peeve. Let's all show a little appreciation for the people who are bringing us local, slow food. If you can't do that, then move on along and do your shopping someplace (I'll refrain from naming names) that trucks its produce in from 2,000 miles away, 6 weeks before its ripe.-COLLAPSE
Crafteeidea, I had no idea there were farmer's markets charging that much. I guess I'm lucky that ours generally has prices comparable (or less than) the grocery store prices. I often rack up a big bill because I tend to buy things that are pricy regardless of where you buy them (raspberries, shitakes, figs, etc), but tomatoes, peppers, etc aren't very expensive here. In my case, I think the...+READ
Crafteeidea, I had no idea there were farmer's markets charging that much. I guess I'm lucky that ours generally has prices comparable (or less than) the grocery store prices. I often rack up a big bill because I tend to buy things that are pricy regardless of where you buy them (raspberries, shitakes, figs, etc), but tomatoes, peppers, etc aren't very expensive here. In my case, I think the prices are very fair for the excellent quality food, so I don't haggle.-COLLAPSE
"This list of so-called rude behavior seems pretty petty to me."
I fully agree with that statement.
Yeah...I don't buy that line about them not sniffing fruit in Europe. Everywhere I have been there is more effort put into choosing the right ingredients, and less of the germ-phobia than here in NA. They would all be sniffing and no one would even think about the germs.
I'm amazed at the attitude of this vendor. It seems like he is getting "burned out" by the grind of producing and retailing his product. I checked out his site, not everyone can afford to pay $6.00 - $25.00 per pound for bell peppers. People have been haggling at farmer's markets for hmmm..... many centuries? If vendors in Santa Monica or Marin don't want to haggle, that's fine, no where is it...+READ
I'm amazed at the attitude of this vendor. It seems like he is getting "burned out" by the grind of producing and retailing his product. I checked out his site, not everyone can afford to pay $6.00 - $25.00 per pound for bell peppers. People have been haggling at farmer's markets for hmmm..... many centuries? If vendors in Santa Monica or Marin don't want to haggle, that's fine, no where is it written that a vendor MUST agree to haggling. But, developing a down right snotty attitude towards his customers is not a positive approach. I'm sure that he has to handle a lot of rude people. And yeah, after a while, that could try a guy's patience. But as a retailer, you gotta be prepared for that. There are books he can read that might help him improve his customer service techniques. If folks on both sides of the table could change their 'tudes a bit and have a little empathy it could be more pleasant and more profitable for everyone. But this whole: "It's my way or the highway" attitude or coming up with rude little animal nicknames for his customers doesn't resolve anything. It just causes animosity. When customers hear what he really thinks about them, then they come up with rude little animal nicknames for him. And on and on it goes. It's not a positive approach.-COLLAPSE
If I'm paying those well-heeled foodie prices, I'm sure as heck gonna fondle and sniff the fruit before I buy it, no matter how germ-phobic we all are nowadays. Just my two snarky cents.
yeah, I have been offered deals many times at my local market. I don't say "are these half off" but sometimes I might ask if there is anything they want to sell at a discount. It might be awkward but that is the price of doing business in a non-standard setting.
if they don't smell fruit in Europe, they're idiots.
at one of California's oldest 'farmer's market's" the Roseville auction, my grandfather wouldn't buy a watermelon until he had smelled it, thumped it, and finally plugged it (cut a hole in it to see if it looked as good as it smelled and sounded.) And yes, he haggled. But he didn't do any of this unless he fully intended to buy what he was checking.
This article is a perfect example of the "Church of the Organic Farmers Market" mentality among so many foodsters. "Thank the goddess these blessed organic farmers sully themselves by coming to our filthy city to sell their produce!" "I'm happy to pay four times more for those peaches than what I would in a store!" If someone doesn't want to give me a deal I won't get mad about it but it's an...+READ
This article is a perfect example of the "Church of the Organic Farmers Market" mentality among so many foodsters. "Thank the goddess these blessed organic farmers sully themselves by coming to our filthy city to sell their produce!" "I'm happy to pay four times more for those peaches than what I would in a store!" If someone doesn't want to give me a deal I won't get mad about it but it's an outdoor market - haggling is part and parcel. Sellers may decline - they may also want to unload that rapidly deteriorating box of strawberries instead of putting in the back of the hot van for four hours. Thanks Ms. Table Manners for reminding me that the recession apparently hasn't hit SF at all (and for letting me know how gauche it is for me to be affected by it).-COLLAPSE
I am amused by the description of the "well heeled foodies" coming to the market. Really??!!! I go to the market at the crack of dawn to get the best selection, so I show up unshowered, wearing a baseball hat and sunglasses. No socializing, haggling, or young children at that time of the morning either. I do admit to sniffing fruit though. If a peach doesn't smell like a peach, then I don't want...+READ
I am amused by the description of the "well heeled foodies" coming to the market. Really??!!! I go to the market at the crack of dawn to get the best selection, so I show up unshowered, wearing a baseball hat and sunglasses. No socializing, haggling, or young children at that time of the morning either. I do admit to sniffing fruit though. If a peach doesn't smell like a peach, then I don't want it. I am interested about the sticker shock too. I have found that the prices at the market aren't much worse, and are often better (eg for red peppers) than at the grocery store. In any case, the quality is so much better that I am willing to pay. If I weren't willing to pay, I would sleep in on Saturday morning.-COLLAPSE
"People pick the produce up and smell it and put it right against their nose. In Europe, you would get your hand slapped right away if you started fondling all the fruit."
Utter BS, I know for a fact that you can easily pick up every piece of fruit or vegetable in both France and the Netherlands until you find one and the seller won't be bothered.
I've been on the other side of the table at the farmers market:
Kids: I don't mind when your kid finds a veg or fruit irresistible. I'd rather see them stuffing a peach in their mouths instead of a pastry or a cone of french fries. But when they pull over boxes of berries or bounce the produce off the floor in the midst of their grab or crawl under my table or are out of control it pisses me off....+READ
I've been on the other side of the table at the farmers market:
Kids: I don't mind when your kid finds a veg or fruit irresistible. I'd rather see them stuffing a peach in their mouths instead of a pastry or a cone of french fries. But when they pull over boxes of berries or bounce the produce off the floor in the midst of their grab or crawl under my table or are out of control it pisses me off. Means they've cost me in bruised product and wrecked table that needs to be cleaned up before the next customer. If they ask nicely and behave politely I'm likely to reward that behavior. Generously. And maybe you too.
Sniffers/handlers: Not a problem. Just be reasonable and don't bruise it. I love the way a person's eyes light up when they inhale the scent of perfectly ripe fruits. My own favorite time to inhale deeply is in the early fall when the grapes start coming in and the market is permeated with the scent.
Party in the aisle: Please, take the humanoid amoeba somewhere else. Like out to the parking lot or over to the tables at the food court where socializing is encouraged. Shoppers can't get to my stand, I'm losing sales, and the customers I do have are annoyed with your space hogging.
Haggling: I offer perfect beautiful produce at competitive prices. I offer cosmetic seconds at reduced prices. They aren't so pretty on the outside but they taste just as fine as the more expensive perfect specimens. The prices are what they are. If you want to buy a half bushel or more, of course I'll give you a really good discount.
Buzzards: See above. Just because it didn't sell at market today doesn't mean it has no place to go or is a loss. Yep, I'm tired and I hate breaking down and loading up, but your half dozen apples isn't going to lighten my load. In fact, you're prolonging the agony.
Most customers and kids are a joy and I really love working the market. It's just the occasional "bad apple" that puts a ripple in it. As in all things, a little consideration by yourself for others makes the experience and day go better.-COLLAPSE
This list of so-called rude behavior seems pretty petty to me. So what if people want to haggle? All the farmer has to do is say the prices are firm. As for not picking up fruit or melons, I'll pick them up and smell them - it's not like I'm wiping my nose on them, but I do agree about not squeezing too hard. As for "buzzards," coming in late to pick up possible bargains isn't rude - it's very...+READ
This list of so-called rude behavior seems pretty petty to me. So what if people want to haggle? All the farmer has to do is say the prices are firm. As for not picking up fruit or melons, I'll pick them up and smell them - it's not like I'm wiping my nose on them, but I do agree about not squeezing too hard. As for "buzzards," coming in late to pick up possible bargains isn't rude - it's very smart. Besides, people wouldn't come late for bargains if farmers didn't offer them in the first place.-COLLAPSE
When my 5-year-old acts like an angle, I ask him to quit being so obtuse. Ha. I amuse me. But seriously, the little stink has actually helped himself to a snack at a farmer's market stall, not understanding that there is a difference between the sellers who put out samples and the sellers who just display their lovely bounty. I quickly broke him of this habit, but when it happened, I offered...+READ
When my 5-year-old acts like an angle, I ask him to quit being so obtuse. Ha. I amuse me. But seriously, the little stink has actually helped himself to a snack at a farmer's market stall, not understanding that there is a difference between the sellers who put out samples and the sellers who just display their lovely bounty. I quickly broke him of this habit, but when it happened, I offered payment for the "snarfed before I could intervene" produce, and the sellers were always kind to us... but I made a point of purchasing something from them anyway, out of gratitude and embarassment over the little snarfer's misstep.-COLLAPSE
If you can't pick your produce, then that's no better than buying those veggies packed in a plastic box. Of course, one shouldn't squeeze a peach and leave fingernail marks, but when one is looking for good produce, it's only natural to smell and be choosy about the qualities.
Come on give the kids a break. They are just being kids. I am like you I don't like out of control kids, but to expect them to be perfect in an environment like a farmers market is ridiculous.
Good grief, if you're not allowed to haggle, to meander about the aisles, to head down at the close of business for cheap deals ... going to the Farmer's Market in the States sounds incredibly boring!