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Foodies Fetishize Their Own
Dear Helena,
The other day I was at my friend’s house, and he used the dishtowel to mop up a floor spill and then to dry the dishes. When I said something, he got defensive. But I don’t want microscopic dirt and pigeon poop specks in my eggs. If you’re at someone’s house, and they do something gross, what should you do?
—Toxic Breakfast
Dear Toxic Breakfast,
As this thread shows, we have wildly differing views on what constitutes proper food hygiene. Some people wipe down their cutting boards with bleach solution and sterilize their sponges in the microwave. Others toss salads with their hands and let the cat walk on the table. Case in point: A few months ago, I had a party for which I decided to make a croquembouche. While trying to assemble it, I spilled a gallon vat of crème pâtissière on the floor. Some people tried to shovel it in the trash; others claimed the “top layer” was edible and consumed it with relish. (For the sake of my personal dignity, I will not reveal in which group I fell.)
But however much your host’s sloblike ways repulse you, it’s rude to correct him. Yes, it’s gross, but whatever “it” is probably won’t make you ill. So what if he tastes the soup and then sticks the spoon back in the pot. “You typically don’t have a whole lot of pathogenic microorganisms in your mouth, and you’re often putting [the spoon] back into a hot pan, which will kill any microorganisms,” says Sam Beattie, a food safety specialist at Iowa State University.
If less than fastidious hygiene bothers you that much, act as you would when dining at a hole-in-the-wall restaurant: Don’t go into the kitchen—or even think about what goes on in there.
There is, however, a very important exception. The biggest culprit of food-borne illness is salmonella, as this report from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention indicates. Salmonella comes mainly from improperly prepared meat, poultry, and eggs. So you must intervene if you see him mishandling any of these foods—like cutting vegetables on the same board used to cut up raw chicken without bothering to clean it in between.
But don’t start yelling and yank the board away from him. Instead, quietly offer to help, advises Marisa Bunning, assistant professor of food safety at Colorado State University. For instance say: “Shall I wash the cutting board so I can get rid of the chicken juices for you?”
Because of fears of H1N1 and the like, it’s hard not to become a clean freak, but remember that you can go too far. Marianna Cherry, a San Francisco writer, says: “I have a friend where I walk into her place and I’m immediately told where the Purell is and I feel like a leper.” That sounds awful to me, so you can probably guess which camp I was in on the crème pâtissière incident. Maybe it’s time we all mellowed out and ate something we dropped on the floor.
As stated by others, I feel it would depend on how well you & your friend got along. If you felt grossed out, but not comfortable enough to say anything, you must not be very close. I've had NO problem telling close friends the dangers of eating something off of a cutting board w/ raw meat juice on it, for example. He looked at us, and ate it anyway, shaking his head. He didn't get sick. but at...+READ
As stated by others, I feel it would depend on how well you & your friend got along. If you felt grossed out, but not comfortable enough to say anything, you must not be very close. I've had NO problem telling close friends the dangers of eating something off of a cutting board w/ raw meat juice on it, for example. He looked at us, and ate it anyway, shaking his head. He didn't get sick. but at least we cared enough about him to warn him about it and perhaps, maybe he will reconsider in the future. But actually nagging? No, we're all adults and no need to badger someone over to your own views, even for safety sake. You always have choices - just choose wisely next time you're eating with this person at their home.-COLLAPSE
I agree with the dissenters. If I saw someone wiping the dishes with the rage s/he had used to clean the floor I would not be able to eat anything from that person's kitchen again, ever. Perhaps several turns with horrifying food-borne illness have made me afraid. I am kidded mercilessly at work for not eating food other people cook, but if you had spent a three day weekend on your knees in...+READ
I agree with the dissenters. If I saw someone wiping the dishes with the rage s/he had used to clean the floor I would not be able to eat anything from that person's kitchen again, ever. Perhaps several turns with horrifying food-borne illness have made me afraid. I am kidded mercilessly at work for not eating food other people cook, but if you had spent a three day weekend on your knees in agony, you would agree. Every single person at work who participated in that potluck was sick. How soon they forget!-COLLAPSE
Nagging AND unsanitary! What a dreadful combination for a cook.
Speaking of eating food that has been dropped...I made a spice cake with cream cheese frosting a few years ago to take to a casual get together. A few moments after getting out of the car at our friends' house the bottom of the plastic "cake-taker" container I had it in broke off and the cake fell on the ground outside our friends back door. After a moment of grieving for my wasted effort and...+READ
Speaking of eating food that has been dropped...I made a spice cake with cream cheese frosting a few years ago to take to a casual get together. A few moments after getting out of the car at our friends' house the bottom of the plastic "cake-taker" container I had it in broke off and the cake fell on the ground outside our friends back door. After a moment of grieving for my wasted effort and ingredients I was able to laugh about it, but my laughter turned to horror when another friend, *along with her dog*, started eating the cake off the ground. Horror was compounded when I realized the cake had fallen in the grass in the hosts' dogs' emergency wee-wee spot. I was never more happy to see the host arrive with a garden hose to get rid of the rest of the cake so this person would stop eating it. That was so unsanitary, although we're still telling stories about it years later, so I guess it wasn't all bad.
As far as kitchen sanitation goes, it would definitely disturb me to see someone use the same rag or sponge on the floor and on cooking/eating surfaces. I'm not obsessively clean, but some things you just don't do. We keep separate cutting boards for meats and vegetables and I'm constantly washing hands and wiping down surfaces when I handle meats, but otherwise I'm pretty relaxed. If I'm chopping veggies and a piece falls on the floor, I'll wash it off and use it. Not for guests though, that would be rude.-COLLAPSE
Sometimes not eating there is not an option. Case in point, my mother in law. Her idea of cleaning a glass or used plate is to give it a three-second rinse, sometimes (if the plate is especially lucky) accompanied by a halfhearted and brief swipe with a paper towel. She owns a dish washer but doesn't feel that it's worth the effort to use it. Every plate and glass in the house is coated in a...+READ
Sometimes not eating there is not an option. Case in point, my mother in law. Her idea of cleaning a glass or used plate is to give it a three-second rinse, sometimes (if the plate is especially lucky) accompanied by a halfhearted and brief swipe with a paper towel. She owns a dish washer but doesn't feel that it's worth the effort to use it. Every plate and glass in the house is coated in a layer of grease, many with crumbs and other sediment clearly visible.
My wife agrees that her habits are a bit... sloppy. But she refuses to say anything to correct Mom. When I am forced to go there I take as much action as possible, quietly wiping things down before anyone in my immediate family touches them. But there's only so much I can do, and when I'm caught I get yelled at. Bad situation, but I do the best I can, and although I feel psychologically disgusting after touching any food there, I haven't actually gotten sick yet...
The punchline came when she visited my home a while ago and freaked out when I left some meat out on the counter to come up to room temperature before grilling. She refused to eat it, insisting that my actions had bred salmonella... *sigh*-COLLAPSE
"But if the plates really were clean with no food or grease residues (were're talking weak bleach final rinse) and they were really well dried and they spent some time around a good strong UV source, like a sunny window, then chances are good that there isn't going to be a problem. The more time that passes in a hostile environment, the more of them die off. Most food born diseases need enough...+READ
"But if the plates really were clean with no food or grease residues (were're talking weak bleach final rinse) and they were really well dried and they spent some time around a good strong UV source, like a sunny window, then chances are good that there isn't going to be a problem. The more time that passes in a hostile environment, the more of them die off. Most food born diseases need enough water, a food source, and time in a danger zone temp before you get enough of them to make you really sick. They are more vulnerable to UV damage which is pretty effective at killing them off, more so than you would think (skin cancer for bugs.)"
aggiecat: This is not true. Glass windows hardly pass UV-light. The amount that gets through is not enough to kill bacteria. So unless you have quartz windows, which I doubt, this will not work. If you have your windows open, it will work of course, but your plate might get contaminated with airborne germs, like spores from moulds and other fungi, bacteria and viruses. A good cleaning with soap, and a decent drying afterwards with a clean towel will make it nearly impossible for any microorganism to live on your plate.-COLLAPSE
Maybe the question shouldn't be whether the guest should say anything. Maybe the issue is the host is trying to gross out the guest and get rid of an unwelcome guest.
Years ago my aunt had a neighbor who always dropped by at dinner time and then stayed and ate. She got really tired of the uninvited guest. So one night after they ate she set the plates on the floor, let the dog lick them 'clean'...+READ
Maybe the question shouldn't be whether the guest should say anything. Maybe the issue is the host is trying to gross out the guest and get rid of an unwelcome guest.
Years ago my aunt had a neighbor who always dropped by at dinner time and then stayed and ate. She got really tired of the uninvited guest. So one night after they ate she set the plates on the floor, let the dog lick them 'clean' and then put them back in the cabinet. The neighbors never ate at her house again. And knowing my aunt, I'm guessing she promptly took all those dishes back out along with any others they may have touched and gave them a good scrubbing.-COLLAPSE
FresserGuy, I too was a little surprised that I almost had to scroll to the bottom of the thread to see your lone comment, so rest assured, you're not alone anymore! I found it a little bit amusing that the answer to how to confront someone about their (probably unknown) food handling/kitchen hygiene/etc. is, "Don't! Lighten up, man!" as if only raw poultry can get you sick or give the 'heebie...+READ
FresserGuy, I too was a little surprised that I almost had to scroll to the bottom of the thread to see your lone comment, so rest assured, you're not alone anymore! I found it a little bit amusing that the answer to how to confront someone about their (probably unknown) food handling/kitchen hygiene/etc. is, "Don't! Lighten up, man!" as if only raw poultry can get you sick or give the 'heebie jeebies'.-COLLAPSE
My father-in-law cuts the fat off raw bacon with the kitchen scissors and only gives them a 1 second rinse under the tap before putting them back in the drawer! He used these scissors to cut the tails off of shrimp when preparing a meal he made for him and my husband and my husband was very sick for two days after eating it.
He also stored a raw chicken breast in the fridge in a ziploc baggie,...+READ
My father-in-law cuts the fat off raw bacon with the kitchen scissors and only gives them a 1 second rinse under the tap before putting them back in the drawer! He used these scissors to cut the tails off of shrimp when preparing a meal he made for him and my husband and my husband was very sick for two days after eating it.
He also stored a raw chicken breast in the fridge in a ziploc baggie, which leaked it's raw juices over everything, as it was put on the top shelf. He didn't understand why I was throwing food away just because it had chicken juice on it, though. He will also leave food out overnight, and has eaten meat that has been frozen for years (I don't think this could make you sick, it's just gross). He is currently slowly drinking his way through a 2 litre carton of eggnog that expired on December 19 2009. Another thing is he will "wash" plates by rubbing his dirty fingers around on them under lukewarm water, no soap(this is something my own dad does too).
I would never say that I am a germophobe, having basically grown up in a barn and having drunk untreated well-water on occasion, but my father-in-law's lack of kitchen hygiene makes me heave, and since we live together I have no choice but to be extra careful when I'm in the kitchen.-COLLAPSE
Because someone got away with poor food hygiene doesn't prove the negative. If you don't follow some of these simple rules, eventually someone will get sick. If you are cooking for someone else, follow the rules for their sake. If its just for you, you can bend the rules, but you still risk your own health. Isn't it just common sense? I know a guy in his 70's who smokes two packs a day and drinks...+READ
Because someone got away with poor food hygiene doesn't prove the negative. If you don't follow some of these simple rules, eventually someone will get sick. If you are cooking for someone else, follow the rules for their sake. If its just for you, you can bend the rules, but you still risk your own health. Isn't it just common sense? I know a guy in his 70's who smokes two packs a day and drinks a fifth of vodka daily and is in great shape! What does that prove?-COLLAPSE
my dad will eat a mcdonalds sausage patty left on his dashboard from the day before. we grew up with the if-you-drop-it-eat-it rule. He's 76 and in amzing health, no joke. think about it.
It would have been best if she/he had said AS IT HAPPENED, "Oh, lets not use that, because we used it to mop up a spill earlier. Then the rebuff would have been in context.
Using the pronoun "we" spreads the blame. Also, the writer could take the offending dish towel and say "where is your laundry, I'll throw this in"
I'm surprised that no one disagreed with Helena.
Personally, I don't think it was wrong of the writer to say something to her friend. I don't think there really is an issue here of someone being likely to get sick (the risk is still low) - it's just GROSS! I mean, I know we all have different standards of cleanliness, but this seems to be someone highly lacking in basic common sense. I disagree...+READ
I'm surprised that no one disagreed with Helena.
Personally, I don't think it was wrong of the writer to say something to her friend. I don't think there really is an issue here of someone being likely to get sick (the risk is still low) - it's just GROSS! I mean, I know we all have different standards of cleanliness, but this seems to be someone highly lacking in basic common sense. I disagree that it was rude of the writer to say something - I actually think the rude person was her friend. When you have friends over, as a host it is your job to help them be comfortable, within reason. I wonder how good a friend this really is. Then again, we don't know much about the people involved. Is this friend a college frat buddy in his early 20's? To me, his behaviour sounds childish. Part of what makes people compatible as friends is having common outlooks and sensibilities. So, if you are a mature, responsible adult (who doesn't feed people off dirty dishes), then it might be hard to be friends with someone who hasn't grown up yet.
Of course, I might be jumping to conclusions here ;)-COLLAPSE
That is a very good idea! What a thoughtful and courteous host!
We both lived in a central neighbourhood of Montréal (Plateau Mont-Royal) that is supremely walkable, so this wasn't even necessary. This was several years ago; I'd be much stricter now. Except for non-drinkers, pretty much everyone will be over the new lower .05 limit after a supper with wine even if they are most reasonable, so it...+READ
That is a very good idea! What a thoughtful and courteous host!
We both lived in a central neighbourhood of Montréal (Plateau Mont-Royal) that is supremely walkable, so this wasn't even necessary. This was several years ago; I'd be much stricter now. Except for non-drinkers, pretty much everyone will be over the new lower .05 limit after a supper with wine even if they are most reasonable, so it is understood that people have to make safe arrangements.-COLLAPSE
A friend of mine had a novel idea for the drunk guest problem. At the SET (11pm) end of his back yard BBQ, 3 van-taxis took everyone to a transit hub (light rail/bus) From there they were on their own, if they chose to go down town and dance, that was their choice. The next day we all came back to pick up our cars and pot luck dishes (Oh and he had coffee for us when we got there)
Well, I have a cat, do pick up things that fall on the floor IF THEY WILL BE COOKED or if I can thoroughly rinse them again - don't assume they were treated hygenically from farm to market. I think we pretty much share each others germs.
It is good to learn the proper procedure for cleaning sponges and cloths - but please don't assume everyone owns a dishwasher (except my cat and mighty quinn's...+READ
Well, I have a cat, do pick up things that fall on the floor IF THEY WILL BE COOKED or if I can thoroughly rinse them again - don't assume they were treated hygenically from farm to market. I think we pretty much share each others germs.
It is good to learn the proper procedure for cleaning sponges and cloths - but please don't assume everyone owns a dishwasher (except my cat and mighty quinn's dog).
I do think a lot of you would be shocked at some of the stuff that goes on in restaurant kitchens...
But the roommate stories were just gross. Yecch.
And Ruth, give it a pass. Booze issues are an etiquette minefield; normal to write about them. I've had to deal with friend who had far too much to drink and insisted on driving home (and she did live close enough to walk, and a taxi fare would have been minimal). I'd love more advice on how to deal with that one.-COLLAPSE
I'm not sure how I'd react to my friend, but I can say that I would have a difficult time eating his food. I would probably plead my (truthfully) ever-present stomach ailment and apologize profusely.
This reminds me of a time when I was at a friend's quarterly potluck. One of the guests grabbed a container of shredded cheese and proceeded to scoop out a serving with her bare hands. She then said...+READ
I'm not sure how I'd react to my friend, but I can say that I would have a difficult time eating his food. I would probably plead my (truthfully) ever-present stomach ailment and apologize profusely.
This reminds me of a time when I was at a friend's quarterly potluck. One of the guests grabbed a container of shredded cheese and proceeded to scoop out a serving with her bare hands. She then said (probably seeing my ill-concealed shocked expression), "Oh, excuse me; I shouldn't have used my hands!" Unfortunately, another guest quickly chimed in with, "Oh, it doesn't matter. Nobody here cares, anyway."
I do. And that's why I don't eat any of the food at the potluck anymore. Not everyone has my "eat-iosyncracies" or my food-prep-iosyncracies. ;)-COLLAPSE
Handwashing is key. As is thorough washing and rinsing of kitchen gear, plates, cutlery etc. My dish towels get one rotation through a meal then they go in the washer. When I cook, I have one dedicated towel for wiping my hands only. I use paper towels for clean ups. Half strength bleach will go a long way in cleaning up surfaces. It's effective for knocking out norovirus- a major foodborne bug.
...+READ
Handwashing is key. As is thorough washing and rinsing of kitchen gear, plates, cutlery etc. My dish towels get one rotation through a meal then they go in the washer. When I cook, I have one dedicated towel for wiping my hands only. I use paper towels for clean ups. Half strength bleach will go a long way in cleaning up surfaces. It's effective for knocking out norovirus- a major foodborne bug.
I have to admit, I have a problem with eating where cats have been around. Cat hair is just insidious and the thought of it getting in food really grosses me out. Of course this is coming from someone who lets her dog "pre-rinse" plates! ;)-COLLAPSE
This ties into the topic about guests hovering in the kitchen, doesn't it? Maybe they are self-annointed cleanliness monitors.
I have to say I'm in the camp that believes the obsession with sanitizers is producing superbugs that cause harder-to-treat illnesses.
Nagging? Don't. You won't change the person's behavior, but you will make him mad.
Ok, there is no such thing as the 5 second rule. Mythbusters did an excellent test of this. And in any house with cats, anything that hits the floor needs to be considered as contaminated. Think it through; cats poop and pee in litterbox, walking on previously pooped and peeded upon litter, bury the litter with their paws and then walk on your floors, counters, tables etc. using their poopy paws....+READ
Ok, there is no such thing as the 5 second rule. Mythbusters did an excellent test of this. And in any house with cats, anything that hits the floor needs to be considered as contaminated. Think it through; cats poop and pee in litterbox, walking on previously pooped and peeded upon litter, bury the litter with their paws and then walk on your floors, counters, tables etc. using their poopy paws. Don't get me wrong I love cats, and they are fastidiously clean, for themselves, but our gastrointestinal tracks are different, have different flora and fauna and different stuff will make us sick. Same for dogs too. However, nothing is as germmy as a small child. I've got one and I should know!
As for the example, OK, you have to consider the floor as contaminated, right? The host just used a towel, contaminated it with whatever spilled, water (water is not so bad, but meat juice would be big time bad juju) and then proceeded to spread the contamination from the towl to a surface that ought to have been clean and which would not get heated or cooked; the plates. Now, realistically, depending on how soon the plates get used and if they are stored in a cupboard or in the direct sunlight and if they were damp and/or not entirely clean would have a whole lot to do with how bad the outcome could get here. If you give food born pathogens a suitable environment and time things could get really, really bad. But if the plates really were clean with no food or grease residues (were're talking weak bleach final rinse) and they were really well dried and they spent some time around a good strong UV source, like a sunny window, then chances are good that there isn't going to be a problem. The more time that passes in a hostile environment, the more of them die off. Most food born diseases need enough water, a food source, and time in a danger zone temp before you get enough of them to make you really sick. They are more vulnerable to UV damage which is pretty effective at killing them off, more so than you would think (skin cancer for bugs.)
As for the sick neighbor, it could have been the coffee cup but doesn't have anything to do with the food, it's all about the bugs on her hands and the surface of the cup, the chairs, the door knob(as the other poster mentioned.) One of the notable feature about H1N1 is that it's remarkably long lived outside of it's host which means there isn't as much help to naturally kill them off on surfaces.
Most food born disease as well as many other kinds of illness get transmitted by hand contact with a surface and then from that surface to an mucous membrane (mouth, nose, eyes). Even when the virus or bacteria can be spread through the air in vapor (sneezing and coughing,) its usually the act of covering the sneeze or cough with a hand and then touching something or someone that typically spreads the fun. Food born diseases add a new wrinkle in that not only can they survive in their human host, they are often perfectly happy in an animal host, that poopy that came out of the animal & human host or in or on some food product so they have a lot more options. Avoiding cross-contamination, correct handwashing and cleaning techniques will solve most of your problems. And the really good news is that most normal cooking temps will wreak armmagedden on their buggy fannies. The bad news is that they often are happy being on things that don't get cooked or are cooked improperly, or hang out too long in the temperature danger zone.
Look, it's no fun getting a FBD, and most of us have at multiple encounters with it a year and have no problem. And, low level exposure to these pathogens can help you build a healthy and appropriate immune system response for future encounters.
But for those who are particularly at risk of having a bad outcome, the elderly, pregnant, young children, and the immune compromised, this is no joke. These bugs are the Borg for us; resistence can be futile and they overwhelm our bodies abililty to beat them into submission. The thing with food borne diseas is that the vast majority of it is completely preventable with good food hyigene practices. You just have to do it. All the time, even when no one is looking.-COLLAPSE
If the writer doesn't eat at this friend's house often I wouldn't make it an issue. And unless you live in a sterile bubble you're probably already eating microscopic pigeon poop and dirt anyway. I toss salads and things with my hands but I always remove my rings and scrub up with antibacterial soap before and after --I even keep an old toothbrush by the sink so I can get under my nails. No one's...+READ
If the writer doesn't eat at this friend's house often I wouldn't make it an issue. And unless you live in a sterile bubble you're probably already eating microscopic pigeon poop and dirt anyway. I toss salads and things with my hands but I always remove my rings and scrub up with antibacterial soap before and after --I even keep an old toothbrush by the sink so I can get under my nails. No one's ever gotten sick so I must be doing something right.-COLLAPSE
People really freak out about some things. The coffee cup story just made me laugh. While I used to be quite careless with my food, except for the raw meat/raw eggs thing, nowadays I'm living with a roommate and his cat. Cats are often carriers of parasites and therefore I don't adhere to the 5 second rule anymore. I often have to stop myself from picking up some food I dropped. I hope I'm not...+READ
People really freak out about some things. The coffee cup story just made me laugh. While I used to be quite careless with my food, except for the raw meat/raw eggs thing, nowadays I'm living with a roommate and his cat. Cats are often carriers of parasites and therefore I don't adhere to the 5 second rule anymore. I often have to stop myself from picking up some food I dropped. I hope I'm not too paranoid about that stuff.
And Ruth Lafler, give it a rest please. We know already.-COLLAPSE
Tasting spoons simply rinsed out and used again is only OK if we are on a tongue kissing level. Raw beef is not going to hurt you unless you or the purveyor make it rotten first . Do all the chicken work in the sink if it really freaks you out. As for storing rendered fat on the counter indefinitely like Mar an Par, and going to the E.D. Stupid is as stupid does. No, colds don't come from food
Re sponges, also dish brushes, dishrags, etc- every few days or whenever I make something that needs cleaning of them, I fill up the small sink with bleach, water, and some dish soap, and soak everything overnight, or until I need to use them next (at least overnight). I press down on the sponges several times to be sure they're saturated, then drain, rinse, and dry. It also spiffs up my sink and...+READ
Re sponges, also dish brushes, dishrags, etc- every few days or whenever I make something that needs cleaning of them, I fill up the small sink with bleach, water, and some dish soap, and soak everything overnight, or until I need to use them next (at least overnight). I press down on the sponges several times to be sure they're saturated, then drain, rinse, and dry. It also spiffs up my sink and makes it all white and shiny.
And for crying out loud, PLEASE reread mountaincachers' first sentence. You won't catch a cold from food OR from going outside barefoot or without a jacket.-COLLAPSE
We all need to be reasonable and comfortable with our level of food hygiene. I work in medicine where we are trying to become even more paranoid re cross-contamination of patients in the trauma ER room, OR, and the examination room. But most of the contaminants in the kitchen dont really fall in this category. Most of it is common sense. Like my college dorm buddy who used to fry steaks and pour...+READ
We all need to be reasonable and comfortable with our level of food hygiene. I work in medicine where we are trying to become even more paranoid re cross-contamination of patients in the trauma ER room, OR, and the examination room. But most of the contaminants in the kitchen dont really fall in this category. Most of it is common sense. Like my college dorm buddy who used to fry steaks and pour the fat back into the unrefrigerated oil bottle for re-use. By the next week he and his girlfriend were so sick they needed to be hospitalized.
Some of food hygiene is absolutely essential, e.g. raw meats, unrefrigerated cream, dirt on lettuce or mushrooms, cutting raw chicken, etc. Much of it is personal cleanliness. Why go through hours of prep for a dinner party and make wonderfully tasty food served with a beautiful presentation, only to make your guests secretly question whether the food is safe to eat. If anyone gets a stomach ache within 24 hours of seeing you pick up something off the floor, guess who gets blamed?
Wash your hands before touching food. Don't pick up dropped food off the floor and use it. Keep a separate tasting spoon on the counter, and rinse it after use. Keep the counter clean. Don't ever give your guests a reason to feel uncomfortable.-COLLAPSE
While I can excuse an older neighbor whose xmas brownies could be counted on to include a hair from her white spitz doggie, I'm amazed at how naive some people are about the most basic issues of cross-contamination. It's not rocket science.
Sponges are cheap. Either put them in the dishwasher with HOT water as Helena advises, or, better still, just throw 'em in the trash and buy new ones,...+READ
While I can excuse an older neighbor whose xmas brownies could be counted on to include a hair from her white spitz doggie, I'm amazed at how naive some people are about the most basic issues of cross-contamination. It's not rocket science.
Sponges are cheap. Either put them in the dishwasher with HOT water as Helena advises, or, better still, just throw 'em in the trash and buy new ones, especially if you've had it around a few months.-COLLAPSE
I have had the opportunity to bite my tongue and not eat anything at someone's house for dinner (as I saw the cat licking the appetizer before it was served) feigning illness never to return; however, when I know the host well, I have to say something. One of my friends has become more sanitary (although she still tastes PORK juices for seasoning before cooking!!!) and I've had more peace of mind...+READ
I have had the opportunity to bite my tongue and not eat anything at someone's house for dinner (as I saw the cat licking the appetizer before it was served) feigning illness never to return; however, when I know the host well, I have to say something. One of my friends has become more sanitary (although she still tastes PORK juices for seasoning before cooking!!!) and I've had more peace of mind eating at her place. I know I'm over the top on cleanliness, but I think I won't be sick from samonella anytime soon!-COLLAPSE
Emm, the viruses that cause colds are not food borne. You would be much more likely to pick those up from her door knob on entering the home than her coffee cup. That being said, some of the examples listed above are gross, whether it's dirty garden tools on the counter or crusty food left all over.
I admit to being a bit of a split personality on this issue. I have been known to invoke the 5...+READ
Emm, the viruses that cause colds are not food borne. You would be much more likely to pick those up from her door knob on entering the home than her coffee cup. That being said, some of the examples listed above are gross, whether it's dirty garden tools on the counter or crusty food left all over.
I admit to being a bit of a split personality on this issue. I have been known to invoke the 5 second rule (for myself, not guests) and think that most Americans are a tad too hung up about germs. However, I am very paranoid about meat/salmonella safety and scour everything very carefully after meat has touched it. Also, if there is any question of funny smells coming from meat or milk, I toss it. So, for the question posed today...I don't think I would say anything about someone's kitchen hygiene unless it involved meat/milk safety.-COLLAPSE
Ok, slightly off topic, but HJsoulma, your comment gave me such a kick-- brought back memories of rooming with 2 guys my senior year and right out of college. I soooo remember those crusty kitchen habits and my glee at getting my first apartment all to myself.
Re Helena's advice - dead on, methinks. The top layer of a gallon of creme patissiere upended on the floor is still pristine, why let...+READ
Ok, slightly off topic, but HJsoulma, your comment gave me such a kick-- brought back memories of rooming with 2 guys my senior year and right out of college. I soooo remember those crusty kitchen habits and my glee at getting my first apartment all to myself.
Re Helena's advice - dead on, methinks. The top layer of a gallon of creme patissiere upended on the floor is still pristine, why let such delectableness (is that a word?) go to waste?
And can everybody please please just treat raw chicken like the radioactive substance it is? Please don't wipe down the chicken cutting board with a sponge, then use same sponge to wipe the counter a moment later. That cute rinse under tap water makes not a whit of difference, okay? Gross and dangerous to boot.-COLLAPSE
Whatever happened to the five-second rule? :-) Seriously, while I might do the occasional unsanitary thing while cooking just for myself when I'm alone (I'm lucky enough to be able to work from home), I wouldn't feed anything of questionable cleanliness/safety to my family or friends.
I'm pretty good at keeping my kitchen clean, but I will admit to reusing a plate (for myself) to eat lunch on if I had served myself toast on it at breakfast. But I would never do that to a guest.
God, it's like my roommates. They spill sauce and dressing on the counter and leave it there to get crusty, don't clean my coffee maker, borrow my other appliances without asking and don't clean them, leave out drinks for weeks until I dump the toxic sludge down the drain and stick the cup in the sink for them, leave pots of open, uncovered soup on the stove for days and days and days until they...+READ
God, it's like my roommates. They spill sauce and dressing on the counter and leave it there to get crusty, don't clean my coffee maker, borrow my other appliances without asking and don't clean them, leave out drinks for weeks until I dump the toxic sludge down the drain and stick the cup in the sink for them, leave pots of open, uncovered soup on the stove for days and days and days until they turn into a hard block of soup concentrate, never throw anything in the fridge away, chop up vegetables straight on the counter and leave veggie shrapnel everywhere, spill on the floor and OWN NO MOP and therefore have nothing to get it up with... *sigh*
Unsanitary cooks are disgusting.-COLLAPSE
You don't have to stop visiting your friend, just stop eating at her home. It is easy enough to have a starbucks with you (or just a thermos cup with your own coffee in it) when you visit and either bring a snack for the two of you or beg off eating. In any event, unless she had a cold recently (or a visitor with a cold), how do you really know the cold came from her.
A little bacteria is good for you.
I had an elderly friend whose kitchen was dirty by most people's standards. For example, she'd just toss gardening tools with soil crusted on them onto the kitchen counters, then prepare food in the same area. I didn't say anything the last time I was there and she picked up an obviously used coffee cup out of the sink, gave it a quick rinse in cold water, and served me coffee from it. A couple...+READ
I had an elderly friend whose kitchen was dirty by most people's standards. For example, she'd just toss gardening tools with soil crusted on them onto the kitchen counters, then prepare food in the same area. I didn't say anything the last time I was there and she picked up an obviously used coffee cup out of the sink, gave it a quick rinse in cold water, and served me coffee from it. A couple days later I came down with a bad cold, and I hadn't really been anywhere else where I was likely exposed. I quit going to her home after that. I just couldn't shake the feeling it had made me sick.-COLLAPSE
It's a miracle! Helena actually gave some good advice (and she resisted the temptation to mention that copious alcohol might be employed to kill the germs).