How to Make an Ecofriendly Surface Cleaner
Irritating chemicals and toxic fumes don’t make for a pleasant kitchen or pleasant cleaning. Mix up your own effective surface cleaner from natural ingredients.
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Does that diluted bleach suggestion cut grease also?
What about using rubbing alcohol in a spray bottle? This disinfects in addition to being a great degreaser, no?
PS: For cleaning hardwood floors, I use the solution in the video with a microfibre mop. Works great, and yes it does degrease to a certain extent.
I second the diluted bleach suggestion. At that strength, it will take you a long time to go through a bottle, it effectively kills germs and is still not as environmentally damaging as some other cleaners. It's also dirt cheap!
Is the OP ever going to justify why this concoction is better than water alone?
I love these "Chow Tips" videos. If you want anti-microbial activity, the American Red Cross recommends one quarter cup chlorine bleach per gallon of water, or one and a half teaspons per pint of water. This solution destroys the cell walls of bacteria.
Of course, the point of the video was to create a less caustic, more user friendly cleaner. The problem is that it is also more friendly to...+READ
I love these "Chow Tips" videos. If you want anti-microbial activity, the American Red Cross recommends one quarter cup chlorine bleach per gallon of water, or one and a half teaspons per pint of water. This solution destroys the cell walls of bacteria.
Of course, the point of the video was to create a less caustic, more user friendly cleaner. The problem is that it is also more friendly to bacteria.-COLLAPSE
Well I've done some looking around, and there is a lot of apocryphal stuff about vinegar as a cleaning agent. There is also some interesting research being done on medicinal uses of vinegar, here's that link: http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/531649_3 and also the American Society for Microbiology has some interesting articles on their website if you search for the term "vinegar."...+READ
Well I've done some looking around, and there is a lot of apocryphal stuff about vinegar as a cleaning agent. There is also some interesting research being done on medicinal uses of vinegar, here's that link: http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/531649_3 and also the American Society for Microbiology has some interesting articles on their website if you search for the term "vinegar." http://www.asm.org/ Apparently adding vinegar to a dilute bleach solution greatly increases its killing power. This, however, is not what the video is talking about.
As for formula 409, it's got something awful-smelling in it. I personally will use ammonia, but not that stuff. Nor will I go near most commercial cleaning preparations, and as for things like Febreeze, ugh. Most of these things contain some really nasty smellifying agents that make me feel sick.
For the rest of it, I mainly just try to keep things clean to begin with and not have to deal with heavy duty cleansing and degreasing agents. I find simple dish detergent does the job if the stove gets oily from sauteeing or the like. And as a vegetarian I don't have to worry about killer bugs from animal products, since I don't have them in the house.
I just can't worry about this anymore, last test is done (I think I did rather well, yay) but another is approaching fast. I will, however, ask my chem prof about it and see what he says, and will report back if he says anything helpful.-COLLAPSE
Yay for Gen Chem! I'm in it too. Well first thing, I really don't see how this soln is so much safer than something like 409 etc. 409 is just a basic soln and what she's just made is an acidic soln. 409 is say also ammonia based? I really don't understand how a common base like ammonia could be considered to be so dangerous (I mean yes you can't drink it but it won't kill you). Most bacteria can...+READ
Yay for Gen Chem! I'm in it too. Well first thing, I really don't see how this soln is so much safer than something like 409 etc. 409 is just a basic soln and what she's just made is an acidic soln. 409 is say also ammonia based? I really don't understand how a common base like ammonia could be considered to be so dangerous (I mean yes you can't drink it but it won't kill you). Most bacteria can live past the pH of vinegar and what she's done is just dilute it even further to make it less effective. Also I'm thinking that vinegar won't be able to cut through the grease and grime since, well, you make salad dressing with acid and "grease" and well they don't mix as you can see since acid soln are obviously polar and grease and oil are not.-COLLAPSE
BBB - Good luck on your test today.
1. I'm not a chemist
2. College inorganic chemistry is 24 years behind me.
3. I didn't stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.
Thus, the following is to the best of my knowlege and recollection.
1. Acetate is not amphiphilic (posessing polar and nonpolar elements, enabling polar (things like water) and nonpolar (things like oil) to interact.
2....+READ
BBB - Good luck on your test today.
1. I'm not a chemist
2. College inorganic chemistry is 24 years behind me.
3. I didn't stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.
Thus, the following is to the best of my knowlege and recollection.
1. Acetate is not amphiphilic (posessing polar and nonpolar elements, enabling polar (things like water) and nonpolar (things like oil) to interact.
2. Water is the "universal solvent" for non-nonpolar substances. Thus, water alone is great for dissolving (and presumably cleaning) the non-greasy stuff in the kitchen--spills of salt, sugar,etc.) It is not good for cleaning up oily material.
3. The OP states that her concoction is not an eye irritant, unlike the commercial alternatives. Huh? I used to work for a company that was developing ophthalmology drugs. The property of being irritating to the eye is related to the pH of the solution with most topical eye drops being around neutral (7) pH. Vinegar has a pH of about 2.5. It has little buffering capacity so the tearing and buffers in the tears will fairly rapidly negate the irritation due to instilling dilute vinegar. However, dilute vinegar is an eye irritant.
4. Given this, I think the OP should provide some justification regarding why her concotion is any better than water alone. She admits that it is not antimicrobial. Thinking about it, if the pH were low enough, given adequate residence time, a dilute solution of vinegar COULD have some antimicrobial activity. However, she didn't advise that it should be sprayed, then allowed to sit for awhile. Given the known pathogens in some commonly used American ingredients, shouldn't a kitchen cleaner have some antibacterial activity? Why not just water?
She is comparing apples to oranges. A Fantastic or Formula 409 (no, I don't work for either company) will be much more effective on oily and water soluble substances AND has some antimicrobial activity. Those are the things that need cleaning up in the kitchen. Yes, they are more dangerous to people and, perhaps the environment. However, her recipe is not a substitute, it is a less effective, less toxic alternative.-COLLAPSE
Correction, H2O and acetate ion are the bases in the case of CH3COOH (aq). H2O is a solvent in most cases anyway, except for grease. So do you know whether acetate ion can cut grease, or act as a detergent in some way?
As for the E. coli 0157:H7, Salmonella, etc., you can go vegetarian, which lets out most food-borne illness, and use organic which lets out even more. And wash all produce...+READ
Correction, H2O and acetate ion are the bases in the case of CH3COOH (aq). H2O is a solvent in most cases anyway, except for grease. So do you know whether acetate ion can cut grease, or act as a detergent in some way?
As for the E. coli 0157:H7, Salmonella, etc., you can go vegetarian, which lets out most food-borne illness, and use organic which lets out even more. And wash all produce extremely well with mild detergent before ever cutting into it or using it, even melons, avocados, etc.
Now I will stop thinking about all this until the test is over!!!
B-COLLAPSE
Ok, test tomorrow so not lots of time to think on this but it occurs that the acetate and OH- conjugate bases in the resulting solution could in fact act as some kind of surfactants. Just a thought. No time to research it now, but is this making more sense?
Hm, indeed, you know I should know that. I will give it more thought!
B
Hmmm.
I think that given that some of our foods are contaminated with potent pathogens like E coli 0157:H7, Salmonella sp, etc, a kitchen cleanser should have some demonstrable antimicrobial activity.
I also do not see how a solution of acetic acid and water is a good recipe for a grease cutter either. To me, in the context of cleaning kitchen grease, "grease cutting" ability is related to...+READ
Hmmm.
I think that given that some of our foods are contaminated with potent pathogens like E coli 0157:H7, Salmonella sp, etc, a kitchen cleanser should have some demonstrable antimicrobial activity.
I also do not see how a solution of acetic acid and water is a good recipe for a grease cutter either. To me, in the context of cleaning kitchen grease, "grease cutting" ability is related to surfactants or use of a non-polar solvent such as ethanol.
Can anyone explain how diluted vinegar cuts grease or dissolves organic material found in a kitchen better than plain water?-COLLAPSE
Hi, Filth,
I'm in General Chemistry right now and I will not be performing the HH thing for you this evening. Sorry, I left that behind with my last exam! :-)
Seriously, though, I think the idea is that this thing cleans surfaces and kills some bugs, not necessarily all. One hopes not to be breeding the kind of things this wouldn't knock out, in the first place. But I see this recipe is more as...+READ
Hi, Filth,
I'm in General Chemistry right now and I will not be performing the HH thing for you this evening. Sorry, I left that behind with my last exam! :-)
Seriously, though, I think the idea is that this thing cleans surfaces and kills some bugs, not necessarily all. One hopes not to be breeding the kind of things this wouldn't knock out, in the first place. But I see this recipe is more as a grease cutter and solvent, and if you keep things free of grease and other accumulations, then chances are that plain old soap would take care of anything else.
Personally, if I wanted to kill microbes without using mass-market preparations, I might mix this up in smaller batches and add Ecover brand chlorine-free bleach, which is just very strong hydrogen peroxide.-COLLAPSE
Hi filth--
I would make no claim as to the "antimicrobial" effects of this cleaner, only that it's an economical and non-toxic replacement for other non-antimicrobial surface cleaners you can pick up.
Ironic that "filth" would make a comment but here goes.
I would like a microbiologist to comment about the effectiveness of her recipe and technique.
Residence time of an effective antiseptic is the key thing. What she has made is a low pH solution of water and acetic acid. I don't remember how to use the Henderson-Hasselbach equation so I'm going to guess that the solution is in the range...+READ
Ironic that "filth" would make a comment but here goes.
I would like a microbiologist to comment about the effectiveness of her recipe and technique.
Residence time of an effective antiseptic is the key thing. What she has made is a low pH solution of water and acetic acid. I don't remember how to use the Henderson-Hasselbach equation so I'm going to guess that the solution is in the range of pH 3.5 with very little buffering capacity.
Is that really the equivalent in antimicrobial efficacy compared to a Fantastic or Formula 409 which, presumably, has surfactants and antimicrobial agents?-COLLAPSE