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Dear Helena,
Last Saturday I went to a new pizza place and it was packed. The waiter asked if we wanted drinks and we said, "No, just tap water." When we ordered our pizzas, he asked us a second time if we wanted drinks. We said no again and he basically checked out for the rest of the night. Should we have felt guilty about taking up a table on a busy night without ordering drinks?
—Healthy Liver
Dear Healthy Liver,
Are you really surprised that big spenders get better service? Servers do work for tips, you know.
Of course, servers won't admit this kind of discrimination on the record. The official line is that all diners are potential repeat customers—not to mention online reviewers—so everyone gets the same attention, whether they are a couple who split a salad or a table of six who order everything on the menu. But once I grant servers anonymity, they confess the truth: On any given night, the prospect of a big tip trumps long-term considerations. As Michael Nagrant, dining critic for the Chicago Sun-Times, says: "There is a direct correlation between the amount of Bordeaux you order and the quality of service you receive."
Alcohol has a high profit margin, but that's not the only reason servers prefer drinkers. Nagrant explains: "Drinkers spend more, and not just on booze." A drinker, Nagrant included, is more likely to order a cheese course, dessert, a postdinner drink, and some coffee. "The kind of person who doesn't order alcohol [usually] won't order all of those things," says Nagrant. "Nothing breeds hunger like drinking." Drinking also breeds nonchalance toward long-term consequences. Who cares what the check is? Let's live a little and order a round of 30-year-old Cognac!
I'll get in trouble with some readers if I say that drinkers have more fun, so let's just say that drinkers often end up in a more convivial mood—and so leave a big tip (unless, of course, they're so drunk they forget to tip altogether).
Obviously, you're perfectly entitled to order as little as you want—though on a busy night, you should avoid "camping" at your table. But you get what you pay for, and in this case, that means less attentive service. Servers may peg you as abstemious or even cheap. Furthermore, nondrinkers can make annoying beverage requests, one server told me. "Hot water with lemon is the bane of everyone's existence": It's time-consuming and free. In other words, the server doesn't get a tip for it.
So yes, unless you order six bottles of San Pellegrino and ask for fresh truffles to be shaved over your pizza, as a nondrinker, you'll inevitably get less attention. But look on the bright side: You won't wake up with a hangover.
Drinkers may spend more on the total bill but that does not mean they will tip more in the end. There are those who know how to tip and those that don't - no matter what they ate or drank. Treat me well through the meal and the tip will correspond accordingly. I rarely order alcohol at a restaurant, but almost always dessert and coffee. If you have treated me poorly because I didn't order a...+READ
Drinkers may spend more on the total bill but that does not mean they will tip more in the end. There are those who know how to tip and those that don't - no matter what they ate or drank. Treat me well through the meal and the tip will correspond accordingly. I rarely order alcohol at a restaurant, but almost always dessert and coffee. If you have treated me poorly because I didn't order a cocktail at the onset, you have only hurt yourself in the end.-COLLAPSE
My ex-husband lost his "real" job (like so many others have lately) and is delivering pizzas. The worst tippers are the folks ordering at the beginning of the month (read: "the welfare checks just came in") and folks ordering in the middle of a blizzard ("It's unsafe for US to go and get food, so lets order a pizza"). A little know fact: the "delivery charge" is just another way for the pizza...+READ
My ex-husband lost his "real" job (like so many others have lately) and is delivering pizzas. The worst tippers are the folks ordering at the beginning of the month (read: "the welfare checks just came in") and folks ordering in the middle of a blizzard ("It's unsafe for US to go and get food, so lets order a pizza"). A little know fact: the "delivery charge" is just another way for the pizza joint to jack up the price of the pie. Out of a 2 dollar charge, he only gets $.50! If you don't tip the drivers, they don't make any money. An extra buck is well worth it to me to NOT have to do dishes.-COLLAPSE
I'm on a budget, not demanding customer and almost always order water. If the waitstaff just tries a little bit I'm also really good tipper . If a waiter decides to be judgmental and write me off, he is only short-changing himself.
I've noticed a trend here of former or current servers and even customers that are talking about people being cheap (aka "scrimp and save" by one person). Can anyone honestly tell me what is wrong with using your money as wisely as you can?? I rarely can afford to go out to eat so, when I do, I'm not there to please the dang server or anyone else that works there. It's their JOB to be nice, do a...+READ
I've noticed a trend here of former or current servers and even customers that are talking about people being cheap (aka "scrimp and save" by one person). Can anyone honestly tell me what is wrong with using your money as wisely as you can?? I rarely can afford to go out to eat so, when I do, I'm not there to please the dang server or anyone else that works there. It's their JOB to be nice, do a good job, not spit or otherwise dispense bodily fluids into my food and please the customer and hope they have done well enough to get a part of my hard earned money! I'm there for the food... not to pay a second time for someone to do their job requirements. If they don't think people pay enough for them to live on, you can always look for a job that doesn't rely on cheap people, like me. (aka stretching what little money we have) The only thing that bugs me more than expecting tips are the places that add a tip right off the bat. Right. Why don't I give you my whole wallet while I'm here.-COLLAPSE
Who decided that it was *alcoholic* drinks the family turned down in favor of water??? I've never known a pizza restaurant to serve hard liquor!! Most of them don't even serve wine! Some of them DO serve beer, in addtion to soda, tea, coffee and **YES** water!! Again, you are speaking from the wealthy persons viewpoint! When we eat at a pizza place, we always order water AND soda. Never a thought...+READ
Who decided that it was *alcoholic* drinks the family turned down in favor of water??? I've never known a pizza restaurant to serve hard liquor!! Most of them don't even serve wine! Some of them DO serve beer, in addtion to soda, tea, coffee and **YES** water!! Again, you are speaking from the wealthy persons viewpoint! When we eat at a pizza place, we always order water AND soda. Never a thought about booze. Who the heck goes to a pizza joint to get liquored up, anyway??-COLLAPSE
Some restaurants charge a HUGE markup on drinks, like one Toronto steakhouse that liked to brag (like it was something to be proud of) about their 500% markup on wine. No wonder a restaurant will mistreat you if you don't buy drinks -- that's where they make most of their money! Maximum profit for minimal effort. It may not be that I can't afford it, but that on principle I refuse to be a willing...+READ
Some restaurants charge a HUGE markup on drinks, like one Toronto steakhouse that liked to brag (like it was something to be proud of) about their 500% markup on wine. No wonder a restaurant will mistreat you if you don't buy drinks -- that's where they make most of their money! Maximum profit for minimal effort. It may not be that I can't afford it, but that on principle I refuse to be a willing victim of highway robbery.-COLLAPSE
XpicassoX, as someone who doesn't drink due to health reasons, I could not disagree more with your assumption that those who don't order drinks can't afford a "proper meal." There are a ton of other reasons for not choosing to drink, either on a specific evening or just in general. Why would you assume that those who aren't drinking are doing so primarily for cost reasons?
I never gave a crap about big spenders when I was a bartender and server. Actually, most of the wealthy customers that were schmoozing and racking up large tabs were the WORST tippers. Now, I would get frustrated with people that would ONLY order water and/or dirty up my ash trays without buying anything, but if they tipped it was fine with me. I have often been dining at a table with my family...+READ
I never gave a crap about big spenders when I was a bartender and server. Actually, most of the wealthy customers that were schmoozing and racking up large tabs were the WORST tippers. Now, I would get frustrated with people that would ONLY order water and/or dirty up my ash trays without buying anything, but if they tipped it was fine with me. I have often been dining at a table with my family in non-smoking and had to go to the bar to smoke, but I always leave a tip. Smoking in an establishment is almost unheard of now though... I think the server in the above scenario is an ass. I am a drinker, but often when I am out these days for dinner, I just want a water. I don't drink caffeine any more and restaurants rarely offer anything else I would like to have in the way of soft drinks. I don't ask for water to be a cheap ass. I just prefer to drink water. I am wondering if this guy even brought them their water because it is unclear above... In any case, I tip VERY well, but this guy wouldn't have gotten much from me. He would have blown it big time counting on his other fat cat customers that I am sure tipped him way less than I would for good service!-COLLAPSE
Audjobb: I assume you weren't referring to me, but I will say that at the time I had dinner at Truffles I was not on Chowhound, did not and still do not blog, nor did I review for any publication including Zagat. So I wasn't looking for bad service. My wife and I went in for the experience (to celebrate our anniversary) as you said. But we didn't get it.
As for how you can pinpoint the food...+READ
Audjobb: I assume you weren't referring to me, but I will say that at the time I had dinner at Truffles I was not on Chowhound, did not and still do not blog, nor did I review for any publication including Zagat. So I wasn't looking for bad service. My wife and I went in for the experience (to celebrate our anniversary) as you said. But we didn't get it.
As for how you can pinpoint the food bloggers easily -- don't they give themselves away when they take out either an expensive smartphone or professional DSLR with macro lens to photograph the food? (and worse, try different angles and settings to get a perfect shot)... I used to mystery shop for a major full-service restaurant chain where I live, and one of the conditions was that we must never be discovered. Did it for 6 years and I don't think I was ever discovered (otherwise I'd have been fired). Of course I didn't have to photograph the food!
So my experience does make me grade restaurant service a lot harsher than most. If a highly regarded independent with high prices can't even match the service quality of a national chain, they deserve to get ripped online and lose 1 1/2 stars out of 5.-COLLAPSE
Considering he came back again to check and see if you needed anything other than your water and pizza was pretty good of him. You obviously got your check and payed, so he didn't completely check out.
I am a bartender and have been in the service industry for the majority of my immature adult life. I do take my job very seriously though. In the course of yelp and all the other online food...+READ
Considering he came back again to check and see if you needed anything other than your water and pizza was pretty good of him. You obviously got your check and payed, so he didn't completely check out.
I am a bartender and have been in the service industry for the majority of my immature adult life. I do take my job very seriously though. In the course of yelp and all the other online food blogs coming to life over the last ten years I have seen a drastic change in how people go out to eat, and how servers do their job. I can pinpoint someone who is going to go home and blog about their experience in an instant. Usually an introvert who wants no more than to be acknowledged and some water, sits quietly, doesn't interact with their server, tips around 12%(usually tips 25-60% at places with "good service"), gets up and leaves, and then goes home and writes a 6 page essay about the terrible service they received, and gives a two star review(the second star was for the ceviche which was "to die for") on their blogspot page that only their mother reads.
You go to a restaurant for the experience of being served and the atmosphere that you desire. Talk to your sever/bartender/host. Embrace the experience of meeting your new friend ______. Tell them you read "the water was to die for" on your sons blogspot page. This guarantees you a spot in this persons memory and they might even come and coddle your needs to be checked in on every five minutes to spruce up that devine tap water of yours. Or don't. Who cares. Come talk to me and you won't be having that problem. I am a glass half full type of guy. Meaning your glass will ALWAYS be half full. Just don't blame your 10% tip on having lackluster service because I read your cousins blogspot page and I know that 38 entries and nothing over a three star review means the service might not be the problem.-COLLAPSE
This is a repost from the boards but fits in here too. It's not just drinks, but spending in general. What really gets me is when I get the short end of the stick because my server also has to serve a big table of "big tippers" or "regulars". Truffles at the Four Seasons Toronto ruined our ANNIVERSARY dinner this way.
We had a table for two. Everything was going fine... until the big round...+READ
This is a repost from the boards but fits in here too. It's not just drinks, but spending in general. What really gets me is when I get the short end of the stick because my server also has to serve a big table of "big tippers" or "regulars". Truffles at the Four Seasons Toronto ruined our ANNIVERSARY dinner this way.
We had a table for two. Everything was going fine... until the big round table across the aisle from us filled up with 10 guys in suits. Needless to say our service went from standard to zero in a big hurry. Water, wine glasses (yes, we did order a bottle) and bread basket sat empty for an eternity. Empty appetizer plates didn't get cleared until AFTER the main courses appeared. Main courses finished, empty plates sat for maybe 15 minutes before being cleared away, and then it was another 10 minute wait before we were offered the coffee and dessert menu. Server had his back to us the whole night, serving the suits, keeping their glasses and bread baskets full, maybe just once coming over to check on us. In the back of my mind I was filling out a national chain's mystery shop evaluation -- failed all timings, failed to check back after food delivery, failed to clear dishes on time, failed to refill glasses... The food was fine, it was what I expected, but for what they charge, I expect service. My wife and I didn't spend $250 on dinner to be ignored. I don't care if the suits paid $200 each. This isn't like an airline where you can buy a first class seat to get better service. We're all paying the same menu prices, we should all get the same service.
The next time you wonder why people go to chains, read this again. You can bet my next meal was at a chain where we were treated fairly because if we weren't, there's a comment card we can fill out, a head office we can complain to by phone or email, probably a few mystery shoppers sent in to keep them honest...-COLLAPSE
As a server, I feel compelled to respond to this. First, I think that the waiter here wanted to double check that his guest didn't need anything else to accompany the main course; not necessarily push drinks. People often change their mind once the food comes. He disappeared because: A) He was super busy with other tables, running food, running beverages, going over the menu with other guests,...+READ
As a server, I feel compelled to respond to this. First, I think that the waiter here wanted to double check that his guest didn't need anything else to accompany the main course; not necessarily push drinks. People often change their mind once the food comes. He disappeared because: A) He was super busy with other tables, running food, running beverages, going over the menu with other guests, bussing tables, ringing orders, and everything else that we do as servers. B) He assumed your needs had been met at that point; your waters were full, you had your food, you were enjoying your food. C) He was annoyed that your check average was low, and he was going to ignore you.
My guess is that if this guest were more observant of their surroundings, they would see that their server was multi-tasking beyond what most people do in a day, and wasn't able to stand by and B.S. with the table, and coddle them as they wanted. YES! we prefer a higher check average, because even at 20-25% Gratuity, WE MAKE MORE. But does that mean that servers are all petty? No, but as the others said, please don't camp at the table because it's Saturday night, there's a wait at the door, and the managers want that table for somebody who is at the host stand complaining about the wait. I still say that everybody should be required to work in a restaurant as a server or host at least once...And about that hot water with lemon...drink it at home already!-COLLAPSE
I'm a non-drinker who loves dining out, and I generally go to the types of restaurants where everyone else is drinking wine. One way I've found to indicate to a server that I'm not just a cheap customer, is to ask "I'm a non-drinker - what are my options?", giving them the opportunity to tell me about their bar's mocktail or the $7 bottle of Pellegrino. I don't really do sugar, so I end up with...+READ
I'm a non-drinker who loves dining out, and I generally go to the types of restaurants where everyone else is drinking wine. One way I've found to indicate to a server that I'm not just a cheap customer, is to ask "I'm a non-drinker - what are my options?", giving them the opportunity to tell me about their bar's mocktail or the $7 bottle of Pellegrino. I don't really do sugar, so I end up with the bottled water. It's cheaper than wine, sure, but indicates that I will be the kind of customer who isn't there to scrimp & save, especially when it comes to the tip. Yes, I wish I didn't have to do this, but it minimizes neglect in the event the server is too bottom line-oriented.-COLLAPSE
I hate to tell you this, but yes you should feel bad about taking up a whole table on a busy night and not ordering drinks. Running any kind of restaurant cost money to run. Restaurants just "Eat Up Money" Rent, Labor Cost, Insurance, Gas & Electric, etc., etc.. If you don't have the money to spend on a proper meal then don't go. Wait til you have the money or go when the place is not busy and...+READ
I hate to tell you this, but yes you should feel bad about taking up a whole table on a busy night and not ordering drinks. Running any kind of restaurant cost money to run. Restaurants just "Eat Up Money" Rent, Labor Cost, Insurance, Gas & Electric, etc., etc.. If you don't have the money to spend on a proper meal then don't go. Wait til you have the money or go when the place is not busy and there are plenty of empty tables. If you're talking about a Pizza Place that has waiter service then yes, you should be ordering drinks, if you're talking about just a plain old pizzeria with self-service then it is OK not to get drinks. Basta.-COLLAPSE
Hubby and I often go out and don't order drinks every time. I'll often just get water and he an iced tea. I can't say I've ever noticed a difference in the level of service, but perhaps now I'll have to pay attention. Although I can recall one particular restaurant where I was looking for our waiter repeatedly to refill my water. We usually tip minimum 20%, and my hubby is more generous than I,...+READ
Hubby and I often go out and don't order drinks every time. I'll often just get water and he an iced tea. I can't say I've ever noticed a difference in the level of service, but perhaps now I'll have to pay attention. Although I can recall one particular restaurant where I was looking for our waiter repeatedly to refill my water. We usually tip minimum 20%, and my hubby is more generous than I, in that despite bad service, he will still tip 20%. Especially the restaurants that we go to, where the food alone can easily bring in a bill of $100 for just an appetizer and 2 meals, I expect good service and I believe the level of service should not be dependent upon whether we order alcohol or not. We know servers are often paid as little as management can get away with, so we make sure that we reward them for good service.-COLLAPSE
If I don't want a drink, I don't want a drink. It doesn't mean I'm a crappy tipper; au contraire, we usually tip above 20%. That does not happen with lousy service, rude service or a snotty attitude. But, then, we tell management why we didn't tip. And, no, we don't leave a small tip, that would only encourage the waitstaff to think that we're cheap. We leave NO tip, except to management that...+READ
If I don't want a drink, I don't want a drink. It doesn't mean I'm a crappy tipper; au contraire, we usually tip above 20%. That does not happen with lousy service, rude service or a snotty attitude. But, then, we tell management why we didn't tip. And, no, we don't leave a small tip, that would only encourage the waitstaff to think that we're cheap. We leave NO tip, except to management that they need to train their staff.-COLLAPSE
It doesn't have to be a busy Saturday night to get bad sevice. When a server hears, "just tap water" (and the word JUST is a cheek clencher) that easily trasnlates into "cheap and maybe a 15% tip if you're lucky". Unfortunately you are now labeled as the table that is squating right where a potential drinker/big tipper could be sitting so getting you out of the seat, and out the door, becomes the...+READ
It doesn't have to be a busy Saturday night to get bad sevice. When a server hears, "just tap water" (and the word JUST is a cheek clencher) that easily trasnlates into "cheap and maybe a 15% tip if you're lucky". Unfortunately you are now labeled as the table that is squating right where a potential drinker/big tipper could be sitting so getting you out of the seat, and out the door, becomes the priority. It's not very respectful but it is a dog-eat-dog world and servers do have to hustle for bigger tips.-COLLAPSE
i understand that waitstaff lives off of tips. but they should still have to EARN those tips. they shouldnt be automatic. once i was at a restaurant where i received "bad to no" service. i left some change on the table. i am normally an 18 to 20 percent tipper, so this was some seriously bad service for me to do that. the server saw it as we were leaving and said "oh, thanks a lot"..all...+READ
i understand that waitstaff lives off of tips. but they should still have to EARN those tips. they shouldnt be automatic. once i was at a restaurant where i received "bad to no" service. i left some change on the table. i am normally an 18 to 20 percent tipper, so this was some seriously bad service for me to do that. the server saw it as we were leaving and said "oh, thanks a lot"..all indignant. i looked him right in the eye and said "you get what you give. i would have given u 20 percent if you had been the LEAST bit attentive. tips arent automatic!" the guy just stood there, mouth agape. i mean, what could he say? he gave us about 70 cents worth of service, so thats what he got as a tip. it shouldnt matter if u order booze or not, if the service sucks, let them know by not tipping well. if they are attentive, tip well. simple as that.-COLLAPSE
I sympathize with servers and really think that part of the problem is management not having to pay servers and bartenders even close to minimum wage, so that servers are so dependent on hustling for tips. (I know a bartender at a popular tavern in an affluent suburb near Philadelphia who also makes $3-something per hour and has to work time at the end of her shift when she's not making ANY...+READ
I sympathize with servers and really think that part of the problem is management not having to pay servers and bartenders even close to minimum wage, so that servers are so dependent on hustling for tips. (I know a bartender at a popular tavern in an affluent suburb near Philadelphia who also makes $3-something per hour and has to work time at the end of her shift when she's not making ANY tips.)
At the same time, servers sometimes seem to forget that drinking alcohol is not a requirement of dining out--beside the fact that some people just CAN'T drink.-COLLAPSE
If it is busy and the server inquired a couple of times about ordering a drink, then not seeing the server again was most likely due to the fact that they were busy running for drinks for other tables not because you just had water with your meal. Its just dynamics, if a table keeps needing drinks then that table would be receiving more attention because the server would need to deliver the drink...+READ
If it is busy and the server inquired a couple of times about ordering a drink, then not seeing the server again was most likely due to the fact that they were busy running for drinks for other tables not because you just had water with your meal. Its just dynamics, if a table keeps needing drinks then that table would be receiving more attention because the server would need to deliver the drink order to that table . Its just common sense. Now if the server did not refill your water or thank you at the end of your meal that is a different story.
But unless you camped out for hours on the table you should never ever feel guilty for spending money at a restaurant.-COLLAPSE
absolutely the waiter should expect to get a tip. that is the unspoken agreement in the North America. in other places (Australia comes to mind) you're not necessarily expected to tip, but your server makes a living wage, not minimum, which no one could live on. I know a guy who worked in an Olive Garden in New York: three dollars an hour, plus tips. do the math. North American servers LIVE OFF...+READ
absolutely the waiter should expect to get a tip. that is the unspoken agreement in the North America. in other places (Australia comes to mind) you're not necessarily expected to tip, but your server makes a living wage, not minimum, which no one could live on. I know a guy who worked in an Olive Garden in New York: three dollars an hour, plus tips. do the math. North American servers LIVE OFF TIPS. Haven't you ever seen Resevoir Dogs.-COLLAPSE
I fortunately have never experienced this. Maybe because I don't drink and my husband does or because I order a diet soda, smoothie or something else. Our drinking and driving laws are so severe here in Ontario that .08 (1 beer) warrants a 24 hour road side suspension and a hefty fine. .05 you are considered impaired. For drivers under 21 any alcohol in your system warrants a 24 hour road side...+READ
I fortunately have never experienced this. Maybe because I don't drink and my husband does or because I order a diet soda, smoothie or something else. Our drinking and driving laws are so severe here in Ontario that .08 (1 beer) warrants a 24 hour road side suspension and a hefty fine. .05 you are considered impaired. For drivers under 21 any alcohol in your system warrants a 24 hour road side suspension and if convicted a 30 day suspension and a fine. Remember the drinking age is 19. So maybe the servers here are use to it. Besides the mark up on non alcoholic drinks is huge. $3.00 for a pop that comes from a fountain? The mark up has to be at least 250%.-COLLAPSE
What a shame that bad service is equated with alcohol. My sister and I are older but enjoy eating out often and always give 20% tip. My sister does not drink alcohol and I usually have a glass of wine. I see many people tipping under the 20% and they are drinking. Very rarely do I tip under the required amount unless the server is obviously ignoring our table, then they get nothing.
The key fact that everyone forgets, especially waiters, is that they are working for their tips. A tip should never be expected unless you have provided the service the customer is expecting. If I am in a sit-down restaurant, and I order water and a pizza, the waiter should, at the very least, make sure I have water in my glass. If I have an empty glass, and the waiter never comes back to check...+READ
The key fact that everyone forgets, especially waiters, is that they are working for their tips. A tip should never be expected unless you have provided the service the customer is expecting. If I am in a sit-down restaurant, and I order water and a pizza, the waiter should, at the very least, make sure I have water in my glass. If I have an empty glass, and the waiter never comes back to check on me, they haven't earned their tip.-COLLAPSE
If waiter's equation is: no drinks = bad service
My equation is: bad service = no tip
Diners of the world, unite and push back.
No you should not feel guilty. But to all those people saying you should get the same service regardless are being silly. Sure maybe if they are career servers at a very exclusive restaurant. At a pizza joint? They don't want you, Europeans, Canadians, ever coming back. Next time ask for a pitcher of water and be done with it. To linger and not order anything would be rude.
I don't get this question at all. If you had food and didn't want drinks, what was the sever supposed to come back for? HL never said that the server was rude or treated them badly. They asked for water and pizza and got water and pizza.
Give me a break. A snobby pizza place? How high maintenance can customers be if all they are eating is pizza with a glass of water?
Some people don't drink because they are driving, taking meds, on restricted diets or simply don't want alcohol in their systems.
TIPS = to insure proper service.
An interesting perspective, but I certainly wouldn't eat twice at a restaurant where I received poor service because I didn't order a drink. Water is what I drink, at home and when I am out. And, contrary to what you may believe, I am often an excellent tipper, but only if I receive good service.
I think, unfortunately, this answer yet another example of a customer being made to feel guilty...+READ
An interesting perspective, but I certainly wouldn't eat twice at a restaurant where I received poor service because I didn't order a drink. Water is what I drink, at home and when I am out. And, contrary to what you may believe, I am often an excellent tipper, but only if I receive good service.
I think, unfortunately, this answer yet another example of a customer being made to feel guilty when really it is the server who should feel bad about not doing their job properly. I have no intention of being guilted into buy a drink so that I can get good service. And shouldn't the server's main concern be doing a good job, not gathering tips?-COLLAPSE
It's funny how the waitservice industry's been able to flip things so that its we customers who are all worried about how we treat the servers, and make their lives easier, and don't do this and dont do that because it irritates them, hlah blah bloah and how the customary tip % keeps inching upwards...
I doubt my waiter feels guilty for expecting an 18% tip on a 300% marked up bottle of wine,...+READ
It's funny how the waitservice industry's been able to flip things so that its we customers who are all worried about how we treat the servers, and make their lives easier, and don't do this and dont do that because it irritates them, hlah blah bloah and how the customary tip % keeps inching upwards...
I doubt my waiter feels guilty for expecting an 18% tip on a 300% marked up bottle of wine, so I try not to feel too guilty on my end either.-COLLAPSE
one more reason to make pizza at home. Regardless of drinks, the overpriced slab of dough and less than 1 lb of toppings (x-large) at $15-$20 depending...servers should appreciate the fact you show up and order at all.
I have to say that recently I have been only ordering water at restaurants, but I don't expect to be served any less than anyone else. If someone provides good service I have no problem giving a 25%+ tip.
If however a server provides little to no service I have no problem giving no tip at all. I have someone close to me that works for tips and service is key. Food can be exceptional but...+READ
I have to say that recently I have been only ordering water at restaurants, but I don't expect to be served any less than anyone else. If someone provides good service I have no problem giving a 25%+ tip.
If however a server provides little to no service I have no problem giving no tip at all. I have someone close to me that works for tips and service is key. Food can be exceptional but service trumps all.-COLLAPSE
Ssharp, not that this excuses it, but as a server, I always grumble a little when someone orders a Shirley Temple or a cherry Coke. I'll get it for you, but it is extra work for me. The restaurant I work at has grenadine at the drink station, but a lot of places you have to take it to the bar. Doesn't excuse rudeness at all though, and no matter how much I don't want to make chocolate milk, hot...+READ
Ssharp, not that this excuses it, but as a server, I always grumble a little when someone orders a Shirley Temple or a cherry Coke. I'll get it for you, but it is extra work for me. The restaurant I work at has grenadine at the drink station, but a lot of places you have to take it to the bar. Doesn't excuse rudeness at all though, and no matter how much I don't want to make chocolate milk, hot cocoa, or cherry coke, I'll bring it to you with a smile and a "No problem!".-COLLAPSE
This has only happened to me once, but it ruined what was a highly anticipated, extremely expensive experience. Back when we lived in Toronto, my husband and I, who were very poor at the time, scrimped and saved for a few weeks so that we could afford to go to one of the city's most acclaimed Italian restaurants to celebrate our three year anniversary. We typically don't drink when dining out for...+READ
This has only happened to me once, but it ruined what was a highly anticipated, extremely expensive experience. Back when we lived in Toronto, my husband and I, who were very poor at the time, scrimped and saved for a few weeks so that we could afford to go to one of the city's most acclaimed Italian restaurants to celebrate our three year anniversary. We typically don't drink when dining out for several reasons (health issues, former alcohol abuse issues, dislike of the taste, and cost predominantly), and this was no exception. We had saved enough to order a good amount of food so that we could enjoy the only trip we'd likely ever be able to afford to this place in a long time, and were very excited based on the reviews that we'd read and the experiences that friends had shared with us. So as to not be a pain and occupy a table at a busy time since we knew we would probably spend less than the average patron, we went very early in the evening when the restaurant was virtually empty.
The waiter warmly greeted us when we arrived and made some small talk. He then asked us what wine we would like to drink that evening, and upon telling him that we would not be drinking, his demeanor instantly changed and he became cold, withdrawn, and for the remainder of the evening, completely inattentive to the degree that we weren't even given the opportunity to order more food or dessert and coffee, and were basically rushed and pushed out the door when the restaurant was still empty except for two other tables. All in all, it was an absolutely horrible experience, and we felt extremely uncomfortable by the waiter's treatment to the point that our appetites were affected.
I most commonly tip 25% to restaurants I like that offer at least decent service, I was so insulted that I wrote an extensive note on the back of the bill regarding how the waiter's poor treatment had essentially ruined a meal that was out of our price range, and supposed to celebrate a very special occasion that we had been looking forward to for quite some time. I left him no tip whatsoever and gave that as the explanation.-COLLAPSE
This is absurd. I just had the same experience. I was the DD to a decent group of people. EVERYONE was drinking but me. I should have received the same service especially considering my shirley temples were on the same check. I usually agree with Helena, and don't even consider her a lush!! This on the other hand is dead wrong. A person should do their job to the best of their ability, period....+READ
This is absurd. I just had the same experience. I was the DD to a decent group of people. EVERYONE was drinking but me. I should have received the same service especially considering my shirley temples were on the same check. I usually agree with Helena, and don't even consider her a lush!! This on the other hand is dead wrong. A person should do their job to the best of their ability, period. The poster should have complained to management. The choice of drink should not mean that the are entitled to NOR DESERVE bad service.
For shame.-COLLAPSE
I used to work as a waitress and frankly I sucked. It was years ago but it has given me some perspective. Often my customers would order drinks and glasses of tap water. I would have a terrible time remembering the water until I learned the simple trick of writing the water down on the check.
Now as a patron I find that I often have to remind my servers more than once about the water. The ones...+READ
I used to work as a waitress and frankly I sucked. It was years ago but it has given me some perspective. Often my customers would order drinks and glasses of tap water. I would have a terrible time remembering the water until I learned the simple trick of writing the water down on the check.
Now as a patron I find that I often have to remind my servers more than once about the water. The ones who remember the first time? I often see H20 scribbled on the check. Hmm maybe I am running with the ball in the wrong direction here. Helena do you ever check back on the comments? Did Liver ever get his damn water? LOL.-COLLAPSE
As a former server in two different, family-owned busy bar/restaurant places, I can say from experience that drinkers always tipped better than the entree-and-water-only patrons. One simple reason is they simply spent less money. Two $15 entree yeilded me a $4.50 tip. I never had an entree/water patron leave a tip that was above the standard 15% (at that time) tip.
I took the opposite approach...+READ
As a former server in two different, family-owned busy bar/restaurant places, I can say from experience that drinkers always tipped better than the entree-and-water-only patrons. One simple reason is they simply spent less money. Two $15 entree yeilded me a $4.50 tip. I never had an entree/water patron leave a tip that was above the standard 15% (at that time) tip.
I took the opposite approach then HL's server, I made sure they had whatever they needed to get that table turned over as soon as possible.-COLLAPSE
To show favoritism towards customers based on the size of the check really isn't professional. That said, I see this often. Sometimes you can actually see the disappointment on the less-experienced server's face when you say "just water will be fine, thanks". My gratuity grows when I am treated well, regardles of what I order.
Yes, very guilty. Now go stand in the corner.
You shouldn't have to feel guilty for taking up a table on a busy night. Even if you just get one slice with no drinks. It's a business, they serve food, you should get the attention you deserve from a wait staff regardless of whether or not you order alcohol. That waiter was dumb. I get really disgusted when customers are made to feel less b/c they're not spending as much as others on alcohol or...+READ
You shouldn't have to feel guilty for taking up a table on a busy night. Even if you just get one slice with no drinks. It's a business, they serve food, you should get the attention you deserve from a wait staff regardless of whether or not you order alcohol. That waiter was dumb. I get really disgusted when customers are made to feel less b/c they're not spending as much as others on alcohol or whatever... I would write a review for the restaurant, criticizing the service. If I go somewhere new, I don't spend too much money there the first time, but if the service is good, I will tip over 20 percent, if the service is bad, I will not only tip 15% to the dot, write a bad yelp review and never go back.-COLLAPSE
Pay servers a decent living wage (you know, like they do in the rest of the world) - problem solved.
In my experience (as a server and as a patron) the total amount of the check is not the biggest contributing factor in a good tip, unless the tip is included in the check. I've been tipped 20 bucks on a cup of coffee.
I'm with redfish62.
And what sort of service is Healthy Liver expecting at a pizza joint? Was there something preventing turning the response by saying, "we'll pass on the beer, but could you recommend a good dessert to follow this up with?"
I can't help but think this kind of attitude is snobbish. Everyone deserves the same amount of service regardless of what they order. As a server for over 10 years in high school and into my early 20's I always tried to give everyone the same amount of hospitality, something that seams unheard of these days. Also it really blows when those "big spenders" don't think about the tip or are so...+READ
I can't help but think this kind of attitude is snobbish. Everyone deserves the same amount of service regardless of what they order. As a server for over 10 years in high school and into my early 20's I always tried to give everyone the same amount of hospitality, something that seams unheard of these days. Also it really blows when those "big spenders" don't think about the tip or are so obnoxious that their "big spending" has me spent and I would just rather they leave right away then even get a tip. Some of the best guests I have waited on were definitely the sober ones who enjoyed my service for what it was and I was rewarded for it-COLLAPSE
I'll take the lousy service over paying an arm and a leg for booze, but I can't recall ever receiving bad service due to ordering just food ... probably because I avoid places with bad service.
Meh, it's reasons like this that I don't eat out often. As nice as it is to sample professionally prepared dishes from ingredients that I might not have around the house, I hate to feel like my presence is resented. If you can find a way to run a business that sells affordable food, which I won't be resented-against for taking advantage of, I'll be a customer. Otherwise, you'll have to wait until...+READ
Meh, it's reasons like this that I don't eat out often. As nice as it is to sample professionally prepared dishes from ingredients that I might not have around the house, I hate to feel like my presence is resented. If you can find a way to run a business that sells affordable food, which I won't be resented-against for taking advantage of, I'll be a customer. Otherwise, you'll have to wait until I strike it rich (or at least not destitute)-COLLAPSE